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The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

151–160 of 205 posts

Re: The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

#151

Highly surprising mammals didn't adapt to this, aren't nitrogen levels the same for 100m years? Being 10% slower is actually a huge handicap, and seems to be something fishy with the idea we live permanently under influence without evolving something like biological counters. A rabbit that is 10% slower will face a huge evolutionary handicap.

Yeah but if everything else is also 10% slower does it matter?!

Re: The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

#152
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yikes, I just checked, and Captain Morgan's is 35% Alcohol. I'm aware of Bacardi 151 (75.5% alcohol) which is like fire water to me. Can't imagine drinking something so concentrated regularly.

You can't judge from Bacardi. It's bottom-shelf, young, and pretty rough. I find it unpleasant to drink neat even at 80 proof. A high-quality, aged rum at 130 proof will be plenty fiery, but not as bad as Bacardi 151 diluted to 130 proof. Of course, the sailors probably didn't drink anything terribly high-end.

> I find it unpleasant to drink

I concur, I tried to acquire the taste for 151 in college and even after 4 years of earnest and consistent effort it did not get better. Similar experiments with Everclear and overproof grappa were also unsuccessful.

I would not recommend any of these if one is interested in a pleasant drinking experience.

Lately I've been finding Bourbon to be enjoyable. Woodford Reserve and Bulleit are well-priced and good introductions in my opinion.

Re: The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know if this applies on the surface, but divers don’t use pure oxygen on dives because of oxygen toxicity.

Sorry if this is pedantic, but we do actually use it for decompression, though usually no deeper than 20ft.

Ahh good point that I forgot. I certified as a rescue scuba diver but it has been almost 10 years now!

Re: The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

#154
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My issue, though, is i can't find a way to safely generate oxygen for a decent price. Depends on the definition of generate and decent price , but you can buy stationary medical oxygen concentrator for $1000, portable for $3000. If you want something easier you can buy pre-filled bottles or refill existing bottles at industrial gas supply places. If you want more, you can get a concentrator setup which small privat…

$1000-$3000 isn't decent for my use case; basically i want to use oxygen instead of ibuprofen for minor aches, coupled with heat or cooling. I find that pure oxygen does wonders for minor headaches and neck pain that i experience. $15-$25 a liter for oxygen is also not a decent price, relatively. At one point i found some concentrators that were ~$500, sadly i did not order and the brand name was alphabet soup; good…

Check on alibaba.com...plenty there for under $500.

Re: The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

#155
post #5

Just completed my deep (40m/120ft) diver certification. A significant amount of the course was focused on nitrogen narcosis, and how to handle/detect it. Apparently, some divers will start feeling the narcotic effect between 20-30m. Beyond 30m, a significant amount of divers can feel the effects. Beyond 40m is the realm of tech diving, with trimix (helium/nitrogen/oxygen) or even heliox (helium/oxygen). I know nothin…

>Except for helium, no other gas exists which does not have some form narcotic effect at higher pressures. According to something mentioned in passing in a Scott Manley (amateur space youtuber) video about deep-sea diving: at high enough pressures you'll get similar effects from helium. It's thought that you can avoid this by subbing out the helium for hydrogen, but nobody so far has been insane enough to try. I assu…

I only have high school level chemistry, but if Helium is a noble gas it doesn't bond and so it can't have a narcotic effect, because it doesn't affect the chemistry of the brain

Re: The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

#156
post #5

Just completed my deep (40m/120ft) diver certification. A significant amount of the course was focused on nitrogen narcosis, and how to handle/detect it. Apparently, some divers will start feeling the narcotic effect between 20-30m. Beyond 30m, a significant amount of divers can feel the effects. Beyond 40m is the realm of tech diving, with trimix (helium/nitrogen/oxygen) or even heliox (helium/oxygen). I know nothin…

>Except for helium, no other gas exists which does not have some form narcotic effect at higher pressures. According to something mentioned in passing in a Scott Manley (amateur space youtuber) video about deep-sea diving: at high enough pressures you'll get similar effects from helium. It's thought that you can avoid this by subbing out the helium for hydrogen, but nobody so far has been insane enough to try. I assu…

> It's thought that you can avoid this by subbing out the helium for hydrogen, but nobody so far has been insane enough to try.

It's reportedly been done very recently using a rebreather (https://gue.com/blog/n1-the-inside-story-of-the-first-ever-h...).

Prior to that, in 1992, there was the French COMEX-sponsored HYDRA 10 experiment that saw Théo Mavrostomos dry-dive in a chamber to 701 meters (71.1 bars) - the world's absolute saturation dive depth record. Though that experiment used "only" 20% H2 (https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg13618493-000-technolo...).

Re: The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

#157
post #5

Just completed my deep (40m/120ft) diver certification. A significant amount of the course was focused on nitrogen narcosis, and how to handle/detect it. Apparently, some divers will start feeling the narcotic effect between 20-30m. Beyond 30m, a significant amount of divers can feel the effects. Beyond 40m is the realm of tech diving, with trimix (helium/nitrogen/oxygen) or even heliox (helium/oxygen). I know nothin…

I had mild nitrogen narcosis once at about 15m (regular PADI open water diver) despite doing similar depth dives before.

It was a worryingly pleasant experience. Like 3 or 4 pints on a warm summer’s afternoon.

Re: The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

#158

Highly surprising mammals didn't adapt to this, aren't nitrogen levels the same for 100m years? Being 10% slower is actually a huge handicap, and seems to be something fishy with the idea we live permanently under influence without evolving something like biological counters. A rabbit that is 10% slower will face a huge evolutionary handicap.

Fish evolved to swim effectively in water, but the viscosity of water still slows them down. Adapting to deal with a problem isn't the same as completely eliminating the problem.

Re: The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

#159
post #5

Just completed my deep (40m/120ft) diver certification. A significant amount of the course was focused on nitrogen narcosis, and how to handle/detect it. Apparently, some divers will start feeling the narcotic effect between 20-30m. Beyond 30m, a significant amount of divers can feel the effects. Beyond 40m is the realm of tech diving, with trimix (helium/nitrogen/oxygen) or even heliox (helium/oxygen). I know nothin…

Your comment about being continuously narked reminded me how in early human history people relied on low-alcohol beer as a safe water supply. So back then it was a double-whammy. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-conflicted-hi...

While other comments have clearly shown that the alcohol in beer isn't strong enough to disinfect it, the way beer is made is that you first have to disinfect the water you're going to use (by boiling it) and then you store the beer in conditions that stop pathogens getting in. So for those reasons the beer would be safer than water, but you'd have just as much success just boiling some water and using it straight away. The other advantage of beer over water is that if it does get pathogens in it, then it is really obvious, and people know not to drink foul beer [citation needed].

Re: The anesthetic effect of air at atmospheric pressure

#160
post #5

Just completed my deep (40m/120ft) diver certification. A significant amount of the course was focused on nitrogen narcosis, and how to handle/detect it. Apparently, some divers will start feeling the narcotic effect between 20-30m. Beyond 30m, a significant amount of divers can feel the effects. Beyond 40m is the realm of tech diving, with trimix (helium/nitrogen/oxygen) or even heliox (helium/oxygen). I know nothin…

It's due to the narcotic effects of nitrogen that GUE (Global Underwater Explorers, a diving association rooted in tech/cave diving) uses EAN32 (32% oxygen) as their standard breathing gas.

They're also more conservative in their recreational diving depths: 30m (100ft) is the recreational limit, beyond that technical certification and a helium-based breathing gas (e.g. Trimix) are required.

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