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The Future of the Vim Project

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Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#101

Post by josephd79 »

OskarS wrote: post #13

My brother passed away very suddenly a few years ago, and I was put in charge of wrapping up and archiving his "digital" life. We were very lucky that we had access to a recovery email for his main gmail account (as well as a couple of passwords that his partner knew) and was able to access and archive virtually all data we could think of (services like Google Takeout were invaluable). I realized that if this had hap…

Now that I think about it, I should probably do the same. I use Bitwarden and they allow you to add an 'emergency contact' that is granted access after X amount of days.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#102

Post by itsthecourier »

OskarS wrote: post #13

My brother passed away very suddenly a few years ago, and I was put in charge of wrapping up and archiving his "digital" life. We were very lucky that we had access to a recovery email for his main gmail account (as well as a couple of passwords that his partner knew) and was able to access and archive virtually all data we could think of (services like Google Takeout were invaluable). I realized that if this had hap…

LastPass let you put two emails as your family members and you setup a 30 day limit to show you are alive. If your loved ones require access to your passwords and you are not there for 30 days, Lastpass release your passwords to them

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#103

Post by ftaghn »

The_Colonel wrote: post #67
oblio wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't be so dismissive. Vim is a marquee project, tons of hackers will want to contribute because it's cool or because they want to have that name on their CV.

> tons of hackers will want to contribute because it's cool It's one thing to contribute a couple of PRs/patches, a very different thing to spend a large part of your free time on the project for years (which is what Bram did to make vim what it is). These projects are no joke and a few hurray contributors not lasting more than a couple of months won't cut it.

> These projects are no joke and a few hurray contributors not lasting more than a couple of months won't cut it.

Those same contributors that remained on vim instead of neovim didn't put much effort into vim9 ecosystem either. I can't imagine them being willing to maintain all of vim's baggage when literally nobody writes vim9script. Classic vimmers tend to stick to the old vimscript.

As you said, contributing a few patches to classic vim is one thing, but becoming an actual maintainer of the behemoth that comes with a ton of useless baggage is a whole another thing. Maintaining a programming language no one uses.. sisyphus would be proud.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#104

Post by coldtea »

GneissFrog wrote: post #16
meitham wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s no future to Vim without Bram. A merge of the two fork’s isn’t what Bram has wanted, but it’s the best way to keep Vim alive

No future for Vim without Bram? People said the same thing about Apple when Steve Jobs passed away. Turns out, as long as you have loyal users and competent people working, things can keep on chugging right along. It seems a bit ridiculous to dismiss reunification when you don't even know what kind of compromises might be made to make it happen.

>No future for Vim without Bram? People said the same thing about Apple when Steve Jobs passed away.

Well, they were making a wrong prediction, but also a totally unrelated to the Vim/Bram situation comparison, then.

This is not the case of a huge multinational company with tens of thousands of employees, hundreds of billions in cash, hundreds of millions of users, a strong product lineup, and a strong C-level team, who has been preparing for 2 years for its CEO eventual demise, complete with another person taking his CEO role way before that happened.

As Apple was at the time of Job's passing.

This is a FOSS software project, strongly associated and mostly solely written almost predominantly by a single person [1], with another fork that has a vibrant community and more modern features.

So, to keep the relevant parts of a comparison, this is an multi-person entity fully prepared for the demise of its leader, with people ready to take over, and stocked to the brims with the essential fuel to continue it's operation (cash), vs an entity that was essentially an one-man-show, with no preparations for the next day, and with a quite popular alternative ready to take over.

[1] Bram has 16,515 commits, the next biggest contributor has 68 times less commits. Or, 1/50th lines added. And it goes downhill from there, with the rest of the contributors added together being 1/50th Bram's contribution as well.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#105

Post by pmoriarty »

infinitezest wrote: post #62
enriquto wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what is it that outweighs all that neovim has to offer? You should ask, and answer, the question in reverse. What does neovim offer me, as a regular vim user? I don't see anything particularly interesting for my usage, so I don't have any reason to change. Also, some features are missing (like gvim-gtk, that I enjoy using to edit LaTeX occasionally). Furthermore, as of today, plain vim has an aura of venerability d…

Maybe not important to some but the ability to use Lua over VimScript is a big win in my opinion. In fact, I use a mix of thr two where necessary.

How much of the rest of the vim ecosystem is Lua-based, though? As far as I know it's still mostly vimscript.

Vimscript's dominance in vim is one of the things that got me to switch to emacs when I got interested in Lisp and Scheme more than a decade ago.

Sure, even then I could write scripts for vim using Vim's scheme compatibility mode, but I'd probably be one of the only ones doing so. Pretty much everyone else was using vimscript.

In Emacs the whole ecosystem is in eLisp, so I'd feel right at home there, could naturally integrate other eLisp codebases/projects, could easily get help on anything related to working with eLisp in emacs.

If I'd written scheme scripts in vim my work would always be a second-class citizen in the vim ecosystem.

How's the vim ecosystem now? Is vimscript still dominant?

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#106

Post by bee_rider »

evanriley wrote: post #87
praseodym wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Call the deceased person's bank to cancel all credit cards in their name and that's taken care of.

Doesn't work for all services. Some services will, if unable to charge the card,send whatever amount to collections, and now they have to deal with that.

Debt collectors are persistent, but hey at least if they follow me to Hell maybe they can take a tour, check out apartments for their stay.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#107

Post by swader999 »

OskarS wrote: post #13

My brother passed away very suddenly a few years ago, and I was put in charge of wrapping up and archiving his "digital" life. We were very lucky that we had access to a recovery email for his main gmail account (as well as a couple of passwords that his partner knew) and was able to access and archive virtually all data we could think of (services like Google Takeout were invaluable). I realized that if this had hap…

The finger doesn't need to be alive to unlock the phone. But yeah, don't put your loved ones through that.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#109

Post by darkwater »

bombcar wrote: post #95
dumpster_fire wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I used to have a massive spreadsheet tracking the entirety of household finances. I was worried that no one would know where the money was if I suddenly died, so I started a monthly finance 1:1 with my spouse. Even wrote an "upon death or incapacitation" playbook for her. The second session was just her saying WTF I can't keep track of the location, ownership and tax benefits of 40 accounts! I've since closed 3/…

The killer for me was working out how much time I was spending playing Excel Warrior and how much it was “making” me and realizing that I was working in my free time for Pennie’s.

Good and honest realization. It seems easy once you do it but it can be really hard to actually get to that point.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#110

Post by woleium »

itsthecourier wrote: post #102
OskarS wrote: post #13

My brother passed away very suddenly a few years ago, and I was put in charge of wrapping up and archiving his "digital" life. We were very lucky that we had access to a recovery email for his main gmail account (as well as a couple of passwords that his partner knew) and was able to access and archive virtually all data we could think of (services like Google Takeout were invaluable). I realized that if this had hap…

LastPass let you put two emails as your family members and you setup a 30 day limit to show you are alive. If your loved ones require access to your passwords and you are not there for 30 days, Lastpass release your passwords to them

But we don't use LastPass after they have demonstrated over and over that they are not to be trusted with our secrets, right?
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