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Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

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Re: Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

#211

Post by OkayPhysicist »

realusername wrote: post #199
TrackerFF wrote: post #175

Having previously worked at a place where it took minimum 3 months to hire someone (but often 6-12), I'd be amazed if Canonical actually ever gets to hire their first choices. What happened was this: By the time the first pick hires had been cleared, they had gotten another job. Same with second pick. Maybe even third, too. Most people don't have the luxury or will to just sit and twiddle their thumbs for months and…

Having done a lot of interviews for my company, I also agree. If your whole process takes more than 3 weeks, you are losing people to competitors. Candidates aren't going to wait 3 months and delaying all the other offers they are receiving, that's not going to work unless you are working in a FAANG maybe and the prestige of your company can make this work.

My current job was less than a week between my application and signing the final offer. Day 1: I send in an application. Day 2: My future manager writes back "Hey, do you have any work examples in obscure language I used for 10 minutes in my EE classes?". I respond "No, nobody has work examples in obscure language." Later that day, same manager emails me again, asking the same question, in slightly different words. I say no again. They respond asking to set a time for an interview. I reply I'm free tomorrow. Day 4, interview. Takes an hour and half. I receive a job offer about an hour later. I reply we need to have a conversation about salary. Weekend rolls through, negotiations are successful and I'm hired on Monday.

Re: Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

#212

Post by chc »

rbanffy wrote: post #171
weinzierl wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

C'mon, it was a casual joke and no harm done. Also punching someone weaker is a simple act, but taking on someone stronger requires courage. Does it fit the somewhat quirky (but by far not unusual) interview process? Yes Is it a sign of a moral flaw? No

Unless, of course, you work for that government. Kind of the same one that put people on the Moon, made the atomic bomb, invented the internet, and other things less extraordinary than repackaging Debian ;-) I have talked to him a couple times while working for Canonical and, while I knew his reputation of being a very Steve Jobs person, he was never an asshole with me. And the CEO was a real sweetheart. I'd think tw…

The Bush Administration did not do any of those things. Reading his comments as a dismissal of those things, rather than the guy running the White House when he wrote it, seems uncharitable.

Re: Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

#213

Post by Invictus0 »

OkayPhysicist wrote: post #211
realusername wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having done a lot of interviews for my company, I also agree. If your whole process takes more than 3 weeks, you are losing people to competitors. Candidates aren't going to wait 3 months and delaying all the other offers they are receiving, that's not going to work unless you are working in a FAANG maybe and the prestige of your company can make this work.

My current job was less than a week between my application and signing the final offer. Day 1: I send in an application. Day 2: My future manager writes back "Hey, do you have any work examples in obscure language I used for 10 minutes in my EE classes ?". I respond "No, nobody has work examples in obscure language ." Later that day, same manager emails me again, asking the same question, in slightly different words.…

This is so unusual it borders on unbelievable

Re: Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

#214

Post by JonChesterfield »

hashtag-til wrote: post #110

(A bit off-topic, but to give another example of where convoluted hiring processes get you to...) Last year, I did 8 interviews (including 4 technical assessments and quizzes) to get an offer from AMD (in Germany) as a software engineer. For completeness, they reached out to me. I wasn't really looking at the time. When I got the offer, salary+bonus was less than what I had at the time (a lot less now) living in a si…

The hiring game is really varied across their teams fwiw. I get the impression the technical lead of some group has total discretion over how to arrive at the yes/no call.

Re: Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

#215

Post by idkyall »

tristor wrote: post #120
hashtag-til wrote: post #110

(A bit off-topic, but to give another example of where convoluted hiring processes get you to...) Last year, I did 8 interviews (including 4 technical assessments and quizzes) to get an offer from AMD (in Germany) as a software engineer. For completeness, they reached out to me. I wasn't really looking at the time. When I got the offer, salary+bonus was less than what I had at the time (a lot less now) living in a si…

Hardware companies simply don't pay as much as software companies in industry. I don't fully understand the reasons, because hardware is often more difficult to deal with than software. That said, I have found that there has been a rash of companies / recruiters reaching out to relatively senior people making offers that wouldn't have been acceptable a decade ago, much less in 2023. I recently had one reach out to me…

> Hardware companies simply don't pay as much as software companies in industry. I don't fully understand the reasons, because hardware is often more difficult to deal with than software.

My theory is it comes down to the margins on software vs hardware products. If you look at software, in a certain sense, your unit margins are infinite - your variable costs are nothing(well, besides the literal bandwidth) to copy a piece of code and sell it to a second customer. With hardware, for every unit of your product, you have raw material cost, mfg, transport, etc. At scale, there's less $ to go around.

Re: Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

#216

Post by ilc »

I got a similar mail when I applied to Canonical.

My mail contained 43 separate questions.

43. I am not joking, I just went and counted them. Each of which probably wanted a sentence to paragraph answer. Some could be more.

As Blaise Pascal said: If I had more time, I would have written a shorter letter. https://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/04/28/shorter-letter/

Write a shorter letter Canonical. You told me so much about you in one step. You can't write a short letter, or you don't care.

Re: Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

#217

Post by PedroBatista »

TrackerFF wrote: post #175

Having previously worked at a place where it took minimum 3 months to hire someone (but often 6-12), I'd be amazed if Canonical actually ever gets to hire their first choices. What happened was this: By the time the first pick hires had been cleared, they had gotten another job. Same with second pick. Maybe even third, too. Most people don't have the luxury or will to just sit and twiddle their thumbs for months and…

> I can understand a hiring process like this if we're talking about fighter pilots, astronauts, special forces operators, scientists going to antarctica, or whatever. But software engineering? C'mon. Delusions of grandeur.

Well.. have you met their CEO?

The truth is once companies have a certain size and revenue, their software developers don't matter really that much. Yes it can be hell to work there, everyone is overworked, things are low quality, etc. As long as the checks keep coming in ( and they will ) there is really no critical problem to be addressed.

Now the funny part: once the alarm bells go off and they try to change course... not happens, the "ship" is unresponsive and in most cases it will sink. But depending on the size of the company that will take years and maybe even decades.

So the best skill everyone needs to have (I wish really technical introverted software developers had this more ) is: Develop "street smarts" and tell these people to go fuck themselves and shove their "hiring process" up their asses.

Re: Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

#218

Post by xen0 »

OkayPhysicist wrote: post #211
realusername wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having done a lot of interviews for my company, I also agree. If your whole process takes more than 3 weeks, you are losing people to competitors. Candidates aren't going to wait 3 months and delaying all the other offers they are receiving, that's not going to work unless you are working in a FAANG maybe and the prestige of your company can make this work.

My current job was less than a week between my application and signing the final offer. Day 1: I send in an application. Day 2: My future manager writes back "Hey, do you have any work examples in obscure language I used for 10 minutes in my EE classes ?". I respond "No, nobody has work examples in obscure language ." Later that day, same manager emails me again, asking the same question, in slightly different words.…

Do you now have any 'work examplesin obscure language'?

Or was the manager just interested in trivia?

Re: Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

#219

Post by prmoustache »

TrackerFF wrote: post #175

Having previously worked at a place where it took minimum 3 months to hire someone (but often 6-12), I'd be amazed if Canonical actually ever gets to hire their first choices. What happened was this: By the time the first pick hires had been cleared, they had gotten another job. Same with second pick. Maybe even third, too. Most people don't have the luxury or will to just sit and twiddle their thumbs for months and…

The only time it took me more than 2 months to get a job, that was also the time I wanted to move to another country. All in all it was nice for me to take the time to ponder on the pros and cons, triple check the kind of quality of life I would have in the expected range of salary, housing, schools, etc.

I am not sure I would stay motivated in another context.

Re: Canonical’s recruitment process is long and complex

#220

Post by ugh123 »

ghaff wrote: post #157
thiht wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> interviewed me while having dinner (on his end) Wtf? Couldn’t he have done that at a more convenient time?

Doesn't seem that odd? I imagine he has a pretty busy schedule.

I've learned over many years that someone who eats during an interview or meeting (while you're not the one eating), doesn't give a shit about you and perhaps has already made up their mind.
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