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Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

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Re: Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

#141
Worldcoin does the whole thing wrong.

What they SHOULD do is to--

1. Scan biometrics. They should not restrict themselves to just irises, because not everybody has irises or eyes. But they should only scan things that you can get surreptitiously without too much work... meaning things that everybody gives away anyway just by walking down the street.

2. Bind the biometrics to keys generated only for that purpose, and never used for anything but attesting to other keys... in zero-knowledge so that you can't associate different sub-keys attested by a given master key.

3. NOT bind the biometrics to names or any other information about the person.

4. Go right ahead and publish the biometrics themselves, together with the associated public master keys. Because again, they are not things anybody should be thinking of as secret... and pretending you can keep them secret is foolish even if you don't put them in a database.

5. Stop centralizing the system that attests to the bindings given in (4); do the work to eliminate trust from that. Or at LEAST don't go out of your way to RELY on a centtral authority.

Once you have that, you have all you need for Sybil resistance, which gives you the global uniqueness they need. Then go build your crypto system on top of it.

Re: Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

#142
post #100
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is wild to me that Altman seems to really believe his company will have a God-On-Earth within the next decade and he still wants to put his name and time into some side hustle? I don't get it. (I think he or his supporters would say Worldcoin is something necessary for the future-AI world, but I don't buy it).

He believes proof of humanity is vital in a world where AI can convincingly pass as human

So, making a buck creating a huge problem, and then making another buck working on the solution to that problem as a side-hustle. Boy, I'm really proud to be working in Tech in 2023...

Re: Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

#143
post #100
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is wild to me that Altman seems to really believe his company will have a God-On-Earth within the next decade and he still wants to put his name and time into some side hustle? I don't get it. (I think he or his supporters would say Worldcoin is something necessary for the future-AI world, but I don't buy it).

He believes proof of humanity is vital in a world where AI can convincingly pass as human

I actually think his actual concern here is humans stealing identities and running bots in order to farm any sort of UBI mechanism that gets set up.

It's not about humans asserting their humanness over some evil AGI/ASI machine, it's about sybil resistance. Malicious humans pretending to be thousands or millions of other humans.

Re: Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

#144

Why does this have to be a crypto currency? My ssn is not a currency and it is used for id. Why can't it be like that, a database of id's? Should we make our drivers licenses or passports into crypto currencies? What is the advantage?

Same as every project that involves cryptocurrency - the advantage is that the scammers who promote it can make money from badly reinventing an existing system.

Re: Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

#145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Altman is not the ceo of worldcoin…

> Altman is not the ceo of worldcoin… I'm just curious who you think the CEO is?

Altman and Blania started it together, and while Altman isn't uninvolved he has at minimum taken something of a step back AFAIK.

As the peer comment says, formally though, Alex Blania is their CEO.

Re: Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does this mean? You already have a unique identity as far as the government are concerned, and who would pay UBI if not the government.

To the best of my knowledge, the IRS has never scanned my eyeball, and yet I'm still able to send and receive money with them. I'm not getting the UBI angle at all. What part of UBI requires new technology?

I’m guessing it’s a way to reduce fraud attack surface without relying on something easily lost, like a portable private key?

Re: Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

#147
post #90

Taxation and control of the money supply is the single most powerful and fundamental right reserved by a government, and it's backed up by lots and lots of guns. Godspeed with changing that, crypto bros.

Do you solve all your problems by shooting people?

Governments tend to

Re: Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sadly, I liked the original idea behind this, and thought it was one of the few actually-interesting applications of crypto currency. If you can (somehow) solve the unique identity problem, you can design a Universal Basic Income using a crypto-currency as backing. The Unique ID problem isn't solved by the blockchain, though, so it ends up being a total mess.

Governments already exist. To try and upend them by replacing their system of personhood and currency is in effect the tech-bro version of a mutiny. It may seem ridiculous but that's precisely what crypto is. An attempt to replace central banks and governments. Tech companies have grown very powerful, and they see an opportunity to create a world-wide "private government" and they're going for it. This won't be the l…

Um, "personhood" and currency aren't anything like the main functions of a government. If you had everything Worldcoin wants to do, it still wouldn't replace any governments.

Re: Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

#149
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would hope both would set off alarm bells but I guess at least one of them inducing trepidation is cause enough these days for guarded optimism.

One of them is easy to include in thrilling action movies that allows the idea and risk to enter public consciousness, and the other is something that economics wonks and people interested in how business works at high levels look at. Protagonist 1: "I don't get it, why are they doing this? What do they have to gain?" Protagonist 2: "I don't know, unless... oh my god, it's regulatory capture!" Protagonist 1: "Shit, o…

"I bear urgent news! The king is planning to destroy the margrave, not by force of arms but by monopolizing the right of seigniorage!"

Re: Police raid Worldcoin warehouse in Nairobi

#150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm actually significantly more skeptical of OpenAI after discovering that one of their founders is behind this. The tag line of universal basic income is so absurd for an iris scanner built on the blockchain. Are we still in the world of 0% interest rates???

You can have UBI at a country level if you finance it with government budget (through taxes)[1], but as a for-profit enterprise, there's no that's a good idea (for it to work at all, it must have a monetization strategy, and they all look dystopian) [1] it actually exist(ed) in France (see RMI/RSA, though the different governments recently added tons of bureaucracy to it as a way to deter people from getting it, ruin…

Is that the kind of UBI we want though? If it has a single issuer, like the government, then it has a single point of control which can be used to coerce people (i.e. by threatening to take it away).

The ideal UBI system would let you threaten to overthrow your government in a way that does not threaten the integrity of UBI. It ought to be a safety net that makes otherwise impractical growth possible.

As a crypto, CirclesUBI is a bit of a disaster (e.g. the hosted UI, and sensitivity to certain kinds of attack), but I think they got the tokenomics right: it encourages Sybil resistant behavior among the users without trying to bind an address to your body and without relying on an issuer's good behavior.

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