1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo • Hacker News Board

Re: 1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo

#51

Post by Baeocystin » Sat, Jul 29, 2023, 9:30 PM UTC

justinclift wrote: post #32

durkie wrote: post #2

In light of the release of Oppenheimer, people have been talking about, basically, the other side of the development of atomic weapons. John Hersey's "Hiroshima" article from the August 23, 1946 edition of the New Yorker came up as the definitive piece on the immediate impact of the dropping of the bomb on Hiroshima, and it is a gripping read: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1946/08/31/hiroshima

Ugh. Clearly the author was paid by the word. That's painfully super stretched out writing. :( Couldn't even make it a 10th of the way through that without losing all interest and moving on.

I've certainly read pieces that were padded and tedious.

This one genuinely, truly is not. Take the first section: every vignette is tightly constructed; you get a sense of the person, the zeitgeist of fear they were living in, and the arbitrary moment that made All The Difference. This structure is repeated point-by-point for each of the survivors, deliberately, to hammer home each element.

Part II has its own structure, emphasizing the chaos. Each part flows well from one to the next. The entire article is an excellent example of writing. It's clear that the author himself is grappling with what to feel about it all. It's powerful stuff.

Re: 1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo

#52

Post by pengaru » Sat, Jul 29, 2023, 9:42 PM UTC

gre wrote: post #25

"The bomb didnt beat Japan, Stalin did" https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/05/30/the-bomb-didnt-beat-jap...

  >     Many Japanese soldiers were soon on their way home from their bases
  > around Japan and were beginning to crowd the trains and buses.  It was
  > difficult for some of them to understand the surrender.  Although most of
  > the Japanese army in the field was still unbeaten, it was stretched thin
  > all across Asia.  The string of horrendous losses at Leyte, Iwo Jima,
  > Saipan, and Okinawa and America's superior air power against the home
  > islands and the use of atomic weapons were evidence enough that the war
  > could not be won.  And then, of course, when the Soviet Union entered the
  > war against Japan after the Hiroshima bomb, there was great fear that our
  > old hypothetical enemy would take advantage of our weakened condition and
  > try to occupy us.  The Soviets seized the southern half of Sakhalin island
  > and four islands just north of Hokkaido - the closest one is in sight of
  > the Japanese mainland - and they still hold them today.  The United States
  > returned Okinawa, which they seized in 1945, to Japanese sovereignty in
  > 1972.
  >
  >     In 1945 the Russians stormed into Manchuria - our buffer against them
  > for so many years - when our forces were relatively small and weakened,
  > unable to defend against massive Russian armor.  There was chaos as
  > Japanese civilians and soldiers tried to escape from the Russians, but in
  > the end about five hundred thousand Japanese soldiers were taken prisoner
  > and sent to labor camps in Siberia and other places in the Soviet Union.
  > Some of them remained prisoners and virtual slave laborers for as long as
  > twelve years.
  >  ...
  > There are those who say to this day that the emperor's decision to
  > surrender was brought about almost as much by the fear of the Soviets - the
  > fear that they might invade the home islands or partition the country, as
  > had been done to Germany - as by the horrible events at Hiroshima and
  > Nagasaki.
  >
  > - MADE IN JAPAN AKIO MORITA and SONY (c) 1986  (any typos are mine)

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1008101.Made_in_Japan

Re: 1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo

#53

Post by Baeocystin » Sat, Jul 29, 2023, 9:48 PM UTC

asynchronous wrote: post #48

veonik wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Barefoot Gen was also adapted as an anime movie and it's... rough. Another heart-wrenching anime related to the bombings is Grave of the Fireflies.

Grave of the Fireflies is about the Tokoyo firebombing raids btw.

*Kobe, not Tokyo. FWIW.

Re: 1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo

#54

Post by nerdponx » Sat, Jul 29, 2023, 9:49 PM UTC

cubefox wrote: post #49

According to a 2015 survey[1], 56% of US Americans say the bombings were justified, while 34% say they were not. This relatively positive (or non-negative) assessment of the A-bombs might have influenced their portrayal in "Oppenheimer", an American production. The Japanese re-screening of "Hiroshima" might be aimed at countering their depiction in "Oppenheimer". [1] https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2015/08/04…

Americans are often taught that the bombings resulted in less loss of life than a conventional land invasion of the home islands. So it's not quite a matter of "A-bomb good". Plenty of Americans alive today lived through the Cold War too, and spent years or decades in low-level fear of nuclear war. It's not quite as simple as "nukes good therefore no criticism of nukes in movie". Part of the interest in things like the Manhattan Project is the grim context of what happened next, and of the alluring eeriness of radiation and nuclear weapons in general.

Re: 1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo

#55

Post by mcpackieh » Sat, Jul 29, 2023, 10:01 PM UTC

Knee_Pain wrote: post #40

mcpackieh wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think his role in that overshadows the rest of his life.

I think he was a human with a rich multi-faceted life and this line of reasoning is exactly how we arrive in 2023 with people who, for instance, don't know about Columbus' genocides because "discovering America overshadowed the rest of his life so we didn't bother to cover it in school". Yeah, no.

Better for a Columbus movie to focus on the genocides than his sex life, no?

Re: 1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo

#56

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Jul 29, 2023, 10:01 PM UTC

thegaulofthem wrote: post #27

gre wrote: post #25

"The bomb didnt beat Japan, Stalin did" https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/05/30/the-bomb-didnt-beat-jap...

That garbage piece of writing completely ignores nearly 80 years of conventional history which includes first-hand account from the very Japanese council cited in the story. Absolute joke content that doesn’t belong on a site like this.

[deleted]

Re: 1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo

#57

Post by mcpackieh » Sat, Jul 29, 2023, 10:03 PM UTC

Knee_Pain wrote: post #50

mcpackieh wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The context of this conversation is people who were traumatized by an atomic bomb. I think atomic bomb to artillery qualifies as such a softening.

And Post Traumatic STRESS Disorder isn't? You got an atomic bomb dropped on you, experienced a literal apocalyptic sun consuming everything you loved first hand and all you (impersonal) can come up with is "stress"? If you want to stay coherent then we should have made up a term specifically to tackle the world-ending experiences these people lived through.

Having known a few people with (war-induced) PTSD, I think stress disorder is a good description of their outward symptoms. However I think your perspective is valid and can see why you think this sounds diminishing.

Re: 1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo

#58

Post by nradov » Sat, Jul 29, 2023, 10:03 PM UTC

gre wrote: post #25

"The bomb didnt beat Japan, Stalin did" https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/05/30/the-bomb-didnt-beat-jap...

Even if the Soviet Union had remained neutral, Japan would have certainly surrendered within a few more months after some more atomic bombs. No nation could possibly sustain a war effort while losing a major city every few weeks.

Re: 1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo

#59

Post by darkclouds » Sat, Jul 29, 2023, 10:07 PM UTC

cubefox wrote: post #49

According to a 2015 survey[1], 56% of US Americans say the bombings were justified, while 34% say they were not. This relatively positive (or non-negative) assessment of the A-bombs might have influenced their portrayal in "Oppenheimer", an American production. The Japanese re-screening of "Hiroshima" might be aimed at countering their depiction in "Oppenheimer". [1] https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2015/08/04…

This is why history is selectively taught at schools. Here in the UK we werent taught anything about Hiroshima but whilst its portrayed as shortening the war, thats using an argument which is hard to prove.

It also means that once that step is taken, ie dropping the bomb, there is no going back, the US will have to remain the dominant power for the foreseeable future in order to prevent retaliation. This then underminds the US rhetoric and western/nato rhetoric when looking at developing countries and countries improving like we see with Russia and China and Chinese desires to bring Taiwan under their fold.

Last century, mid 80's I remember a conversation on what subjects to study for UK GCSE's. If we had to take a language, most could only study French, those in the top also studied German and could take that as an language exam subject.

This person same age, ie teenage said they were going to study Mandarin, and I asked why. Well his father worked in the City of London and they could see back in the mid 80's China was going to over take everything economically in the next few decades. Fast forward to now and thats what you are seeing along with the European bloc aka the EU being formed.

So it looks like economics is being used to drive the creation of trading blocks and these economic blocs appear to drive political blocs, but the local media spin things to divert peoples attention away from whats really going on.

Anyway this Hiroshima film is likely to placate the Japanese elders and remind them they are not forgotten as are the events that took place.

Me personally I detest violence, and I couldnt think of a worse job than being told to go kill someone based on someone elses orders, no matter how it is spun. I've heard about some of the things that went on in Japan, I dont know how true they are, like all of history I take it with a pinch of salt because of the saying, the victor writes the history books, but even now I cant believe so many people were willing to go fight for a side, its just an out and out bad situation whatever side you are on.

Re: 1953 'Phantom' A-bomb film 'Hiroshima,' with 88,000 extras, screening in Tokyo

#60

Post by wiseowise » Sat, Jul 29, 2023, 10:08 PM UTC

Knee_Pain wrote: post #13

wiseowise wrote: post #5

This is what Oppenheimer should’ve been about. Not SPOILERS Mediocre politics, sex, boredom biopic.

A movie about Oppenheimer's life should be about... the immediate fallout of the bomb on the Japanese population?

A movie about Oppenheimer should’ve at least shown what haunted him and weight of his decisions, not one minute (!) of Oppenheimer watching some background video showing surprised face like on this video.

https://youtu.be/6pc0u-iqIDw