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Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

reuters.com

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Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#681

Post by cyanydeez »

nmridul wrote: post #338
malwrar wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually got stranded once for some hours because of the mileage indicator! Was driving back from a campsite that I turned out to not have charging compatibility with, but thought I had plenty of margin to get to the nearest charger. As I drove through the mountains however, I began noticing that a.) my battery was depleting much faster than expected and b.) I wasn’t seeing any houses and very few motorists. I watc…

>> (turns out you need one that has a full bed because of the regenerative breaking, and tesla’s service doesn’t have infinite coverage) Is there a service for "On demand battery charging". A mini truck carrying a generator that can be called to the location. Could charge premium from the EVs that are too tired to move.

You'd think they could fit a generator function and charge during tow

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#682

Post by 01100011 »

dzhiurgis wrote: post #649
01100011 wrote: post #593

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Nope, no towing. Drove about half those miles and spent about 45 minutes at a supercharger, then drove another 35 or so and spent a little over an hour at another one. In the second case I was trying to get to 90% so I could return the car above the 72% I picked it up at. We ran the A/C most of the time. I was driving pretty conservatively with about 50/50 highway/city streets. I did try to show off the acce…

1h45m at supercharger, depending on charging curve, should result in 200-300 miles. So maybe you were just queueing at supercharger or something else doesn't check out at all.

Queueing? Would the supercharger limit my charging time for some reason? I drove right up to an open charger every time, so I wasn't waiting in line.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#683

Post by hooloovoo_zoo »

01100011 wrote: post #591
hooloovoo_zoo wrote: post #526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a fellow 2017 Outback owner, Subaru at least sent out a notice to have this fixed for free in April 2019.

I never got that notice. There is also a firmware bug related to undercharging the battery(shutting the charger off too early) which was also not communicated to me and resulting in getting stranded with a dead battery. Fortunately the car was in a retail parking lot that time and not in the middle of nowhere on the 5 freeway in central CA like when we ran out of gas.

I’m sympathetic I’m just saying they’re not totally ignoring the problem. There was a battery related class action too https://www.subarubatterysettlement.com/

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#684

Post by soundsgoodtome »

dietsche wrote: post #160

As a Tesla owner, I think the source of the confusion is the EPA range displayed in the HUD on the Tesla. We toggled ours to show the battery percentage, which is much more useful to us. We've never owned a gas vehicle that met it's EPA range and the Tesla is no different. No one takes EPA MPG * GALLONS of gas and expects it to be a real life estimate of range. Wind resistance increases EXPONENTIALLY with speed. Driv…

The article says that Tesla knowingly overestimated their numbers. Tesla even switches the range algorithm to be more accurate when mileage gets to 50%.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#685

Post by gonehome »

ethanbond wrote: post #679
gonehome wrote: post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah - it's pretty wild, Tesla really committed to this a decade ago and has been chipping away at it since, the investment paid off. Even better, strategically Tesla created the "NACS" or North American Charging Standard which is a clever name for their far superior Tesla charger. They also pivoted from the superchargers being an exclusive reason to buy a Tesla to licensing them for other EVs - now Ford is onboard,…

Can you explain why other manufacturers switching to NACS is advantageous to Tesla? Are they collecting fees or is there some reason bp or Shell or Exxon couldn’t just add NACS chargers to all their real estate and steal share from Superchargers? I have yet to see any explanation as to how the switch to NACS is actually good for Tesla, other than testimony to the standard design being better than CCS?

It’s licensed access iirc so they’re getting some payment for it (which they deserve for their investment in building it out despite the odds).

They also charge a higher rate to non-Tesla EVs.

The other benefit is if they continued to refuse access they could have ended up like blackberry. The other companies would have adopted the CCS standard and (eventually) would have a competitive network. Then what was once a Tesla advantage would become more of a liability as the transition to EVs gets more complete.

Few companies make this strategic shift at the right time imo and I think Tesla did. By leveraging their advantage now it’s a win win.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#686

Post by dzhiurgis »

01100011 wrote: post #682
dzhiurgis wrote: post #649

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1h45m at supercharger, depending on charging curve, should result in 200-300 miles. So maybe you were just queueing at supercharger or something else doesn't check out at all.

Queueing? Would the supercharger limit my charging time for some reason? I drove right up to an open charger every time, so I wasn't waiting in line.

Assuming rather low 50kW charge rate thats at least 87.5kWh of energy. Thats 500km of highway range. Assuming more average 75kW rate - 130kwh or almost 900kms. And you are claiming you done this in one day?

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#687

Post by Incipient »

willcipriano wrote: post #673
7thaccount wrote: post #563

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On a highway my hood latch broke (old car) and it flew up at 50 mph and crushed my windshield. I had no service (but knew the other carrier would have full bars) and spent over an hour waving at every car trying to get someone to stop to let me call my parents (I was 18 and not exactly intimidating). It was a crazy experience as I'd obviously had an accident. Nobody would help. Finally I just stood in the road like a…

I know what gender you are.

Apache helicopter? I wouldn't stop for one of them either.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#688

Post by audunw »

rootusrootus wrote: post #187
dietsche wrote: post #160

As a Tesla owner, I think the source of the confusion is the EPA range displayed in the HUD on the Tesla. We toggled ours to show the battery percentage, which is much more useful to us. We've never owned a gas vehicle that met it's EPA range and the Tesla is no different. No one takes EPA MPG * GALLONS of gas and expects it to be a real life estimate of range. Wind resistance increases EXPONENTIALLY with speed. Driv…

> We've never owned a gas vehicle that met it's EPA range and the Tesla is no different. No one takes EPA MPG * GALLONS of gas and expects it to be a real life estimate of range. Because gas stations are still far more common than fast chargers. We'll get there with EV charging, but right now range does matter, especially if you routinely see half of what was advertised.

Who are “we”?

Right now it varies a lot where in the world you are. I don’t have exact numbers but I have a feeling there’s more fast charging locations around me than gas stations. (There may be more gas pumps but it doesn’t matter because most EV owners here don’t use fast charging as their main method of charging)

I guess this is only true in like 2-3 countries in the world right now. But it’s changing very rapidly.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#689

Post by abustamam »

frumper wrote: post #622
leemelone wrote: post #482

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and that should be obvious right? Let's say you're familiar with how fast your car eats gas and you drive around on flats all the time. When you take it into the mountains, it's not surprising that your gas gauge goes down a bit faster when you're pushing that gas pedal a little further than usual. Perhaps the takeaway is that EVs shouldn't so prominently display the range as part of the "gas" gauge the way they tend…

I have it show percent, not range. Tesla defaults to percent on the main display. I'm not sure about other cars. When you use navigation then Tesla will show you the expected charge at your destination and it's been pretty accurate.

I drove my wife's Model 3 on a short trip from Sacramento, CA to Santa Cruz. 3.5hrs if you factor in traffic (2.5hrs without).

When we left, estimated range was 45% on arrival. We arrived with 27% range. Granted, we did encounter a crapload of traffic, but the Nav system took that into account because the time was accurate.

I don't fully fault Tesla for the range inaccuracy; an ICE car would probably have had a similar issue. But it's not as smart as I thought it was, which is a shame.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#690

Post by abustamam »

pests wrote: post #619
lowbloodsugar wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using the trip counter isn't the same as entering the destination in navigation. If you tell navigation your destination it will tell you if you're going to make it or not. If you start driving like a madman halfway through it will reevaluate and start navigating you to a charger. I rented one for a week and took it up into the mountains, far from a charger. It was scary, but we made it back with 17% charge once I st…

I'm aware - pretty sure they did chart the trip in autopilot though from my reading. Telling the autopilot system you are headed to a supercharger also starts pre-warming the battery.

That's a bit annoying to me to be honest. It's a cool feature, but sometimes I want to plan out a trip without having to prewarm, or I want to prewarm without having to navigate. I can imagine why it's automatic instead of manual (imagine if someone prewarmed their battery but forgot to charge or something) but it'd be a nice "advanced" thing to have.
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