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Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

reuters.com

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Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#181

Post by cevn »

tekla wrote: post #150
cevn wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could, but they don’t. Edit: someone else pointed out if you actually navigate then it will show remaining % more accurately. Still seems like false advertising..

How is it false advertising.

I don't use navigation, almost ever, after the first place I go somewhere. Therefore, the main battery estimator is just wrong. If it actually worked, as soon as you got to highway speeds you would see it half. Hiding the real estimation behind the navigation tool is cowardly

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#182

Post by ravenstine »

gonehome wrote: post #122

I don’t really get the range complaints at this point, with an ICE vehicle people rarely know their range they just look at a gauge for F to E. With the superchargers, range doesn’t really have a material effect anymore and most of the time the network isn’t necessary anyway. It’s not a real issue.

That's because, even today, gas stations are far more ubiquitous than charging stations. People who own IC cars don't pay that much attention to range because there's rarely a question that they'll find a gas station within their last remaining gallon. With electric, that's a bit of a different story, especially when you're driving a long distance, and to somewhere that's not a major metropolitan city with thousands of Tesla owners.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#183

Post by cevn »

stetrain wrote: post #148
cevn wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah I see. I will check on that but you would think that as soon as you get on the highway that estimator would change. It is also the first place someone would look for range, not inside navigation so I would call that false advertising…

I leave the battery meter set to percentage, the “miles” option is really just percentage dumbly mapped to miles. The golden number in a Tesla Is absolutely the navigation route estimate. While navigating you can open the Energy app as well to see more detail, how you are doing compared to the estimate, and specific factors affecting consumption.

I also use percentage. It's not something that I usually think about. I just know that my "real range" is 180 miles at highway speeds. That's not something they tell you when you buy a Tesla.

I also just don't use navigation if I've been somewhere more than once. Just navigate with my head..

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#184

Post by rootusrootus »

edude03 wrote: post #145

I have an S so I'm biased but this feels like a hit piece. Range is of course always going to be an estimate. Marketing is always going to be a battle of who has the bigger number. Having people schedule an appointment to fix their "broken" cars that can only go 470 instead of 500km is of course going to be a waste of time and money. I'm part of a facebook group for tesla owners and literally every day this week ther…

I've owned EVs from different brands, including Tesla. In my experience so far, only Tesla uses the naive and wildly optimistic EPA number for the range display. My wife drives a Bolt and it uses your moving average to calculate the range estimate, and it's pretty much dead-on accurate.

Tesla -could- do it but chooses not to. Put it in trip mode and it's pretty close to dead-on. Look at the consumption page and it's pretty accurate there too. Tesla elects not to use this already available information, because it would consistently show people a lower number than what the web page did when they ordered the car.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#185

Post by ke88y »

JimtheCoder wrote: post #73
vagab0nd wrote: post #51

Not just battery and range. I've had problems with the passenger side airbag not enabling, and turn signal not working. Both scary issues. Made appointments with the support. Both were cancelled outright by them (!). They tried to convince me that there was no problem, and it was all due to the way I use the car. They seemed to try everything to get out of appointments. My wife had to use the back seat for a month wh…

"My wife had to sit at the back of the car for a month while I argued with them." She must have enjoyed having a chauffeur for a month...

Chauffeurs tend to drive vehicles that are more comfortable than the back seat of a Tesla. Sitting in the back seat of any non-luxury sedan sucks.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#186

Post by tekla »

cevn wrote: post #181
tekla wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is it false advertising.

I don't use navigation, almost ever, after the first place I go somewhere. Therefore, the main battery estimator is just wrong. If it actually worked, as soon as you got to highway speeds you would see it half. Hiding the real estimation behind the navigation tool is cowardly

How is that any different from a ICE car?

How is the car supposed to know how much energy you might be using in the future?

Last time I checked, no ICE car has the ability to predict the future.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#187

Post by rootusrootus »

dietsche wrote: post #160

As a Tesla owner, I think the source of the confusion is the EPA range displayed in the HUD on the Tesla. We toggled ours to show the battery percentage, which is much more useful to us. We've never owned a gas vehicle that met it's EPA range and the Tesla is no different. No one takes EPA MPG * GALLONS of gas and expects it to be a real life estimate of range. Wind resistance increases EXPONENTIALLY with speed. Driv…

> We've never owned a gas vehicle that met it's EPA range and the Tesla is no different. No one takes EPA MPG * GALLONS of gas and expects it to be a real life estimate of range.

Because gas stations are still far more common than fast chargers. We'll get there with EV charging, but right now range does matter, especially if you routinely see half of what was advertised.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#188

Post by dubeye »

jvanderbot wrote: post #8

I have a model Y. I hate almost everything about it. But most germane, The "Battery meter" at the top of the display is total bunk. That's got to be "rosy" numbers. It'll display a the battery in miles, but it's at least 25% inflated. However if you punch in a destination, you'll get exact numbers, and those are insanely reliable. It claims (and I don't believe any claims coming from tesla) that it'll factor wind, el…

The obvious question is why don't you sell the car if you hate everything about it.

Sunk cost and all that

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#189

Post by stetrain »

vel0city wrote: post #156
wintermutestwin wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know someone who bought an early Leaf to get to work and back. The stated range was 107 miles and their commute was 35 miles each way. The problem was that there was >2000 feet of elevation change.

I don't quite get this. It was a round-trip thing right, like the overall net elevation change at the end of the day was 0, right? All that energy was stored as potential energy, they'd get it back rolling down the mountain. To my understanding a round-trip it shouldn't have made that much of an impact.

Regen braking is not 100% efficient, closer to 70-80%. So climbing a mountain and then going down the other side does cost more net energy than driving the same distance on flat ground.

Also if the elevation change is such that you don’t have enough to get to the top, the amount you would regen on the way down doesn’t matter.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#190

Post by swader999 »

I rode ebikes for commuting about 15 years ago. Looking at electric cars, I need at least double whatever specs they state for max range. So if I need 400 miles for instance, I need to find a manufacture promising 800. Wind, cold, age of battery, emergency reserve etc all play into it.
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