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Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

reuters.com

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Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#81

Post by jncfhnb »

londons_explore wrote: post #16
jvanderbot wrote: post #8

I have a model Y. I hate almost everything about it. But most germane, The "Battery meter" at the top of the display is total bunk. That's got to be "rosy" numbers. It'll display a the battery in miles, but it's at least 25% inflated. However if you punch in a destination, you'll get exact numbers, and those are insanely reliable. It claims (and I don't believe any claims coming from tesla) that it'll factor wind, el…

Battery meter at the top is EPA range - ie. the official range measurement method, in basically ideal conditions. The routefinder 'learns' from your previous driving habits. Driving style easily has a 50% impact on range between "drives 50 mph slipstreaming behind a truck" and "drives 90 mph and brakes aggressively at every corner".

When you say “learns” is it actually factoring in the route or is it just using the historical average miles per… what, kWh, and multiplying it across the distance

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#82

Post by BaseballPhysics »

hammock wrote: post #19

How does the Tesla advertised range compare to the advertised range of other EV makers: less accurate, or similarly inaccurate? edit: "advertised" I mean the range shown on the dash. I.e. the range communicated by the car itself, as relevant to this article.

> How does the Tesla advertised range compare to the advertised range of other EV makers: less accurate, or similarly inaccurate?

Read the article. This is covered in depth and it's quite informative.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#83

Post by JimtheCoder »

Y-bar wrote: post #46
antisthenes wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Seems like it’s common across all EVs for the range to be inflated by around 20%, at least for freeway driving. Most people speed on the freeway. Extra speed reduces range significantly.

This. And it is true of petrol cars as well. In my old clunker going from 110 km/h to 120km/h is a 9% speed increase but nets about 15% extra fuel consumption.

Is this with the windows up or windows down...?

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#84

Post by jackmott42 »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #78
londons_explore wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Battery meter at the top is EPA range - ie. the official range measurement method, in basically ideal conditions. The routefinder 'learns' from your previous driving habits. Driving style easily has a 50% impact on range between "drives 50 mph slipstreaming behind a truck" and "drives 90 mph and brakes aggressively at every corner".

I thought braking aggressively increases range.

if you brake too aggressively then you will use brake pads as well as regen, and that wastes energy.

Also, its still better to arrange to not need to brake at all, than to regen, since regen is not 100% efficient.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#85

Post by javajosh »

WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #7

Inside the Nevada team’s office, some employees celebrated canceling service appointments by putting their phones on mute and striking a metal xylophone, triggering applause from coworkers who sometimes stood on desks. That's a fairly amazing display of corporate customer contempt. Shareholders couldn't have shown more disdain for their consumers.

I think it's also an opportunity for each of us to appreciate the frailness of the human condition. In particular, how plastic our minds our, how susceptible to "narrative" and social pressure (particularly when connected to income) we are. I imagine those employees are pretty normal people, and they were just responding to incentives. They didn't feel they were harming anyone, and in fact were doing a good job according to their bosses. They work at a famous, respected company and surely if the bosses were wrong that would not be the case, right?

This is the utility of the cynic, the questioner, the doubter, the non-conformist. It is an uncomfortable position, at all times, but you need people among you who constantly fear being inadvertently, mindlessly immoral. Because it's a constant threat and more of a threat, I daresay, than overt evil.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#86

Post by jackmott42 »

londons_explore wrote: post #16
jvanderbot wrote: post #8

I have a model Y. I hate almost everything about it. But most germane, The "Battery meter" at the top of the display is total bunk. That's got to be "rosy" numbers. It'll display a the battery in miles, but it's at least 25% inflated. However if you punch in a destination, you'll get exact numbers, and those are insanely reliable. It claims (and I don't believe any claims coming from tesla) that it'll factor wind, el…

Battery meter at the top is EPA range - ie. the official range measurement method, in basically ideal conditions. The routefinder 'learns' from your previous driving habits. Driving style easily has a 50% impact on range between "drives 50 mph slipstreaming behind a truck" and "drives 90 mph and brakes aggressively at every corner".

EPA range is a mix of city and highway range. City range is > highway range, thus EPA range will over estimate highway range and underestimate city range.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#87

Post by wredue »

ke88y wrote: post #32
TheAlchemist wrote: post #5

That's a pretty damning article and it looks like there are more and more of those coming. Tesla still somehow benefits from its innovators / clean company reputation, but at this pace it won't be long before agencies start to act on what's become much more than just 'optimistic marketing'.

I think that reputation already died in the last 2-3 years. It's now pretty common in my circle to hear people say they'll pay a premium to not own a Tesla. Primarily because of lots of bad experiences with build quality/repairs, but also because there are now lots of high quality alternatives. Namely Rivian and Lucid, but also the legacy automakers (two friends bought mach-es recently and there's a smattering of F-1…

Our caravan has been a pile of shit, which I’m sure anyone who’s ever had a caravan can attest to.

Anyway. We are looking for reliability and imagine my surprise when Kia, of all brands, came out king of generally affordable reliability. Plus their EV reviews reasonably well.

A lot has changed in 10 years for vehicles I guess…

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#88

Post by sethd »

wredue wrote: post #70

>Inside the Nevada team’s office, some employees celebrated canceling service appointments by putting their phones on mute and striking a metal xylophone, triggering applause from coworkers who sometimes stood on desks. It’s weird how this sentence was probably supposed to surprise the reader, but I really just reflected on how the fans conduct themselves regularly and thought “yup, sounds about on par”.

Just like a scene out of The Wolf of Wall Street. This company appears to be fraudulent to the very core.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#89

Post by goshx »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #78
londons_explore wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Battery meter at the top is EPA range - ie. the official range measurement method, in basically ideal conditions. The routefinder 'learns' from your previous driving habits. Driving style easily has a 50% impact on range between "drives 50 mph slipstreaming behind a truck" and "drives 90 mph and brakes aggressively at every corner".

I thought braking aggressively increases range.

Not if you use the break pedal

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#90

Post by xutopia »

bilsbie wrote: post #77

It’s a controversial opinion but I really believe EV’s need 500 miles of range to truly compete with ICE vehicles. Think: batteries not fully charging or depleting for longevity concerns. Having to stop at chargers before range is out due to there not being another one coming up, extra headwinds, extra heat or AC, simply ending up at a broken or crowded charger and needing it to a different one, pulling a load, etc,…

I think you're wrong. The vast majority of "trips" are well below current ranges afforded by today's technology. Most electric car users are plugging in when they get home and never have to charge elsewhere.

Furthermore battery technology is actually improving and the trajectory seems to indicate that there will be cars that will be able to hit the 1000km range within the next 5 years for those who would need it.

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