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Rethinking Window Management

blogs.gnome.org

221–230 of 272 posts

Re: Rethinking Window Management

#221
post #159

People generally have pretty good spatial sensibilities, and I feel like modern OS designers seem to forget this. You feel this especially on iPadOS. Physically arranging windows allows for a much more solid multi-tasking experience, and encouraged direct manipulation of content e.g. drag and drop. Transient "palette" or "panel" windows allow for a short term buffer (think a find/replace panel). To me, this is what m…

Conversely I regard modal dialogs as one of the worse sins a ui designer can commit. Sometimes necessary, but they should never willingly interfere with interactivity. This then sort of leads into the next point. Overlapping windows. It lets you put more applications on the screen at once but it does not really do much for the user in terms of workflow. The window underneath is obscured so I can't really use it witho…

> When I am working I ether want to see a few windows at once(documentation|editor) (reference|photoshop) (chat|web) or I want to only see one application, I never go "Oh boy I am glad I can only see half this window".

Actually, thanks to "responsive design" and whatever other new inventions, I often go "boy, would I like to only see half this browser window" when I want to have the (documentation|editor) setup on a smaller screen (i3 on a laptop). Because I want to see the actual documentation, not the multiple navigation menus that take up half the browser window. And no, I can't zoom in and pan, because then it will trigger some breakpoint and whatnot and the text becomes comically huge as it thinks I'm reading on a phone.

Re: Rethinking Window Management

#222
post #139

People generally have pretty good spatial sensibilities, and I feel like modern OS designers seem to forget this. You feel this especially on iPadOS. Physically arranging windows allows for a much more solid multi-tasking experience, and encouraged direct manipulation of content e.g. drag and drop. Transient "palette" or "panel" windows allow for a short term buffer (think a find/replace panel). To me, this is what m…

I really appreciate apps that open new windows where it makes sense, but I'm pretty sure the reason it died out is because people started using too many windows for conventional floating window managers to handle. I'm not sure if many people really felt the burden it would have caused, because the growth in number of windows arguably began with having many webpages open at once, and firefox, and then later internet e…

It was definitely ie7 and not ie6 that had the tabs.

Re: Rethinking Window Management

#223

People generally have pretty good spatial sensibilities, and I feel like modern OS designers seem to forget this. You feel this especially on iPadOS. Physically arranging windows allows for a much more solid multi-tasking experience, and encouraged direct manipulation of content e.g. drag and drop. Transient "palette" or "panel" windows allow for a short term buffer (think a find/replace panel). To me, this is what m…

The chat inside Gmail (I'm not even going to pretend to know or care what they call it now) has separate "windows" for each chat.

Re: Rethinking Window Management

#224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not saying that everyone should be like me. I am genuinely asking what the use cases are for something else.

My screen is 4 and a half feet wide. I use Windows Power Toys on Win and a Tiling windows manager on Linux. Each app goes to their specific location. The center 1920x1080 is for the main focus and the rest is for peripheral/supporting apps. Here's what my development desktop looks like[1] 1: https://keeb.dev/2022/06/12/I-made-a-keylogger/desktop-full....

I must say when you said your screen was 4.5' wide I had a negative reaction. How could someone use that much real estate? Wouldn't your neck hurt from the looking around?

However, after seeing your screen capture I have to say that I'm pretty impressed and kind of want a super wide screen for myself now. Main content in the center with no overlapping windows means that everything is within eyeshot without having to touch the mouse or keyboard. I've always hated the idea of multiple monitors (one for main work and another, often smaller, for tools) but your layout has made me rethink my desires. Thanx!

Re: Rethinking Window Management

#225
post #70

Gnome developers really like automoving stuff on the screen, like activities animations. Instead I could kill a window that does not stay put were I placed it. Who does it thinks it is to know better than me how my desktop must look like? Anyway, until there is a way to work as I want to, no problem with them enjoying their time. Reconfiguring the desktop to look like Gnome 2 is a tax I pay to have them keeping it co…

You're the second person that calls the activity window overview moving windows. In what way are the windows being moved? They're just being unstacked so that you can find that window 3rd from the bottom on the stack.

I should log out and log in with guest user with an unmodified desktop, let me see if I can find a video on YouTube.

Found one. Check this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3A3ewGh7u3g at 1:20. That guy is about to open the activities overview or whatever it is and that will move windows around.

Then go to 2:25, more windows movements in a few seconds using a different feature of Gnome.

I can't stand that and I happily undid all of it using various extensions.

Re: Rethinking Window Management

#226

People generally have pretty good spatial sensibilities, and I feel like modern OS designers seem to forget this. You feel this especially on iPadOS. Physically arranging windows allows for a much more solid multi-tasking experience, and encouraged direct manipulation of content e.g. drag and drop. Transient "palette" or "panel" windows allow for a short term buffer (think a find/replace panel). To me, this is what m…

You made me think about how my phone has 5 times as many pixel across as my first PC(I personally owned) yet I can't do half as much with those pixels as I could with that PC.... How is 3000 pixels not enough to let me arrange windows myself but 640 was?

I know you are just ranting, but the size of the corresponding pixels is just vastly different. You can VNC/RDP into a desktop from your phone — try to actually click what you want afterwards. Let’s not pretend that designers are mentally challenged or something.

Re: Rethinking Window Management

#227
post #144

> Overlapping windows can get messy quickly Yeah dude... that's one reason why the Minimize button exists on Windows, MacOS and KDE etc for so long. When you see some feature exists for this long on this many good desktop environments, you know it's too important to...say...been removed (from default setting)? Also on the same note, Taskbar (or Dock on MacOS) is also important... It's so important that on SOME deskto…

I"m glad it doesn't exist, since i'd have to turn it off :) But seriously, I use GNOME because of what it is, not because of what it's not.

You mean the Dock/Dash or the Minimize button?

The Minimize button is still accessible on some windows if you right click the title bar and select "Hide". So the function is still there, just more annoying to access.

And the Dock/Dash problem is actually linked to the minimize feature. Because when user click Minimize, the window then needs a place to be "minimized to" (and an animation is also need to show how it happened). Maybe the lack of Taskbar could be one of the reasons why Minimize button was removed? Just me guessing.

I do respect your use case, but as a desktop environment, I don't think GNOME should implement it as default. But on the other hand, if GNOME is really committed to be a tiling-first desktop environment, then removing the Minimize button could be a reasonable plot on the roadmap.

Re: Rethinking Window Management

#228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're the second person that calls the activity window overview moving windows. In what way are the windows being moved? They're just being unstacked so that you can find that window 3rd from the bottom on the stack.

I should log out and log in with guest user with an unmodified desktop, let me see if I can find a video on YouTube. Found one. Check this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3A3ewGh7u3g at 1:20. That guy is about to open the activities overview or whatever it is and that will move windows around. Then go to 2:25, more windows movements in a few seconds using a different feature of Gnome. I can't stand that and I happily…

... yeah, nothing is moving your windows, it's literally just a preview. This is like saying that the Windows menu bar preview is duplicating your windows.

Re: Rethinking Window Management

#229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I should log out and log in with guest user with an unmodified desktop, let me see if I can find a video on YouTube. Found one. Check this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3A3ewGh7u3g at 1:20. That guy is about to open the activities overview or whatever it is and that will move windows around. Then go to 2:25, more windows movements in a few seconds using a different feature of Gnome. I can't stand that and I happily…

... yeah, nothing is moving your windows, it's literally just a preview. This is like saying that the Windows menu bar preview is duplicating your windows.

The Windows menu bar doesn't move. The activities overview moves my screen. That's unnecessary and intolerable ;-) We all have our own quirks.

By the way, I added a Windows style task bar to the bottom of my desktop. It autohides and that's OK because it doesn't move my windows upward when it appears.

Re: Rethinking Window Management

#230
post #148

As a longtime macOS user, while I don't mind the rest of how it handles windows/apps I've never liked the fullscreen mode that was added in 10.7, and the GNOME fullscreen mode mentioned in the blog post is identical. I don't maximize windows often, but when I do I don't usually want the window to be spirited away to its own separate universe, and the apps that actually need fullscreen implement that functionality ind…

I use almost exclusively fullscreen windows in macos. A couple of apps are splitscreen. I like to have 2 terminals side by side. And there is a kitchen sink screen where I put random windows.

I tried that (e.g. having one workspace for my fullscren IDE, then to the "right" of that a workspace with a fullscreen terminal), but I found macOS rearranged my workspaces, so about 10% of the time when I went to the app by Ctrl-Left and Ctrl-Right I'd end up looking at a different app. So annoying!

I found there was an "Automatically rearrange Spaces based on most recent use" which I could switch off, which helped, but it still did it sometimes (I can't remember why now).

So now I just don't use that feature at all, which is a shame. It was just too jarring to be looking at the wrong thing 10% of the time, really broke the flow.

Plus when you use Ctrl-Left and Ctrl-Right you have to wait for the animation to end before typing, otherwise your key presses are lost, which isn't great when you want to Ctrl-Right twice to get to the terminal and then type a command. Have to always remember to wait 0.5 seconds or so before typing otherwise you've typed "s -l" rather than "ls -l" etc.

Do you have the same problems, and if so how did you solve them? I'd love to be able to use this feature but for me it was just too annoying.

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