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What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

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Re: What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

#151

Post by pkilgore »

quasarj wrote: post #44
blt wrote: post #31

> You don’t need a license to operate these aircraft because they’re easy enough to fly that the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) doesn’t see the need to regulate them. I don't think that's the reason. The reason is that they are unlikely to hurt anyone besides the pilot in a crash. They can have an engine failure, stall-spin, or fly into a cloud just as readily as any other plane. Those are the biggest risks fo…

Flying into a cloud is a big risk? They're everywhere!

Flying into meaning literally inside. You can fly among them in VFR assuming you meet minimums for the airspace (3SM visibility, 1000 above, 500 below, 2000 to the side in most areas of the USA).

I have only been in actual instrument conditions once with an instructor who was certified to do so under and instrument flight plan. It's disorienting. It's turbulent. Its impossible to avoid other planes (IFR the tower keeps you separated).

Crosswinds and rain and landing are basically boring after a few tens of hours. But fuck clouds.

Re: What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

#152

Post by Kerb_ »

srvmshr wrote: post #144
godelski wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> E.g. If you have been professionally diagnosed with ADHD, the FAA bans you from any pilot's license ever, even a student license Not quite true. They just need you to be evaluated where you've been off medication for at least 90 days. But if you're on Adderall, you're shit out of luck. Which is pretty dumb since the medication resolves issues. Other dumb things that will/can prevent you from getting your license: A…

Why discriminate against diabetes. Of the things listed, this is probably the most common one & a lifestyle disease. This can have a onset in mid-40s to 50s for some genetically predisposed people. Are they not allowed to fly then?

Diabetic shock while flying would be pretty bad. They seem to do individualized assessments, it's not an instant removal. https://diabetes.org/tools-support/know-your-rights/discrimi...

Re: What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

#153

Post by jjav »

amluto wrote: post #105
Dalewyn wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the same vein, the only reason you need a license is because you use publicly owned space. For a mundane example, consider your driver's license. You only need it because you drive on public roads and highways; a driver's license is a license stating you are competent enough to not ruin the shared public roads and highways. Likewise, a pilot's license is a license stating you are competent enough to not ruin the s…

> Hell, you probably don't even need to register that car. In California at least, you are required to file for “planned non-operation”, which is inexpensive but not free.

> In California at least, you are required to file for “planned non-operation”, which is inexpensive but not free.

Nothing requires you to do that. In theory (sometimes in practice) a NOOP registration makes it easier to re-register it back to street use later.

If you have no interest in driving it on the street, no need for any kind of registration or payment. I've had race cars where I've left registration lapse, since I'm not driving them on the street it doesn't matter. I own (in CA) two cars right now for which I haven't paid registration in a very long time, as they are not street cars.

Re: What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

#154

Post by jjav »

inconceivable wrote: post #115
taneq wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that the same as de-registering the car? In Australia if you have a car that you don't intend to drive on the road, you can just hand the number plates back. They refund the remainder of your licensing fees and you're done. The car can still be driven (even without a driver's license) on private land, just not public roads. If you want to drive it on the road again, you have to re-register it and get it inspected.

it's not the same. un-registering and re-registering a car in california is a giant bureaucratic pain in the ass.

> it's not the same. un-registering and re-registering a car in california is a giant bureaucratic pain in the ass.

Have you done this? I have, multiple times. Not a big deal.

There is no process for "un-registering" a car in California that I know of. Just stop paying annual registration.

To re-register it, if you did not pay NO-OP fees, in theory you need to pay for the years you didn't pay to get up to date but aside from the cost, it's easy.

I say in theory because having done this three times, I've never been asked to pay the back fees. One time the agent waived all the fees, the other two times they waived all the past years except one. But if you get an angry agent having a bad day, you might have to pay more.

Re: What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

#155

Post by jjav »

oceanplexian wrote: post #134
taneq wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that the same as de-registering the car? In Australia if you have a car that you don't intend to drive on the road, you can just hand the number plates back. They refund the remainder of your licensing fees and you're done. The car can still be driven (even without a driver's license) on private land, just not public roads. If you want to drive it on the road again, you have to re-register it and get it inspected.

The California DMV hates people who own cars with a passion. I moved out of California and forgot to inform them, so 2 years later they levied my bank account for $500 of unpaid vehicle registration fees. Oh yeah, registering a car costs several hundred dollars per year.

No reason you should have to pay that.

As I mentioned in a peer comment, I've owned many cars (and still own two) where I simply stopped paying registration (California). As long as I don't drive them on the street in CA, the CA DMV doesn't care.

Re: What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

#156

Post by Dalewyn »

pkilgore wrote: post #150
sonicshadow wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

This comment contributes nothing. There are multiple levels of licensing with multiple levels of medical clearances. Someone on controlled ADHD medication, diabetes, or high BMI is perfectly capable of managing risk of flying as a private pilot same as boating or driving. They probably shouldn't be airline transport pilots, but that's not really under discussion. It seems like your goal here is to start some sort of…

FAA's regulations are draconian, but they are that way because they are written in blood.

When shit goes south, it doesn't matter whether you're a private or commercial pilot. Your plane is coming down regardless, and worst case you might take some other people with you to the other side.

More than anything, flying is a luxury compared to something like driving which is a practical necessity or sailing which carries far lower risks of destructive danger. Nobody needs to fly, so more stringent regulations are warranted for what is a very dangerous activity that must be handled with respect.

"Diversity" has no place in aviation, either you can fly safely or you can't. People with conditions are presumed they can't, for very good reasons.

Re: What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

#157

Post by Dalewyn »

sugarkjube wrote: post #122
grepfru_it wrote: post #73

Unpopular opinion but technically correct answer: you can fly any plane without a pilots license. In fact I just saw a Quora question with this exact question and the answer came from a 60 year old pilot that has been flying without a license for 30 years. If you never fly out of a major airport where an FAA inspector can ramp check you, who will ever find out? Please don’t do this.

You can fly a plane without a licence just like you can drive a car without a licence. No problem at all. Until you're caught or in a crash. You can't however, unlike a car, fly a plane without having been taught. If you try, you may be able to get in the air, but the difficult part is getting back on the ground alive.

We can't drive a car without having been taught either.

Granted, the amount of training required to drive a car pales in comparison to flying an aircraft, but it's not like humans can just drive a car straight out of the womb.

Re: What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

#158

Post by godelski »

Kerb_ wrote: post #152
srvmshr wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why discriminate against diabetes. Of the things listed, this is probably the most common one & a lifestyle disease. This can have a onset in mid-40s to 50s for some genetically predisposed people. Are they not allowed to fly then?

Diabetic shock while flying would be pretty bad. They seem to do individualized assessments, it's not an instant removal. https://diabetes.org/tools-support/know-your-rights/discrimi...

This is the reason. Nuance is also common for some things on the list (e.g. HIV/ADHD but not all things, e.g. AIDS/Color blindness). But all these things are still lacking of a lot of nuance and things like diabetes has only recently been partially resolved due to large lobbying efforts of the ADA: https://diabetes.org/tools-support/know-your-rights/discrimi...

Re: What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

#159

Post by ai_monkey »

paulddraper wrote: post #117
grepfru_it wrote: post #73

Unpopular opinion but technically correct answer: you can fly any plane without a pilots license. In fact I just saw a Quora question with this exact question and the answer came from a 60 year old pilot that has been flying without a license for 30 years. If you never fly out of a major airport where an FAA inspector can ramp check you, who will ever find out? Please don’t do this.

I'm a private pilot. This is basically correct. If your airport is small and you never get in trouble with ATC or have an emergency situation, you will probably not get caught. However, if you do get caught, it is a criminal charge with (IIRC) up to $250,000 fine and 6 years prison time. Or worse, you overestimate your ability and die/kill people. I wouldn't take that risk. If you want to fly a lot, get a license. If…

When and where did you get your information? Because this is completely wrong. LSA's and gliders rely on self-certification for the very medical reasons you mentioned. In smaller aircraft where you don't carry passengers and don't fly in demanding circumstances (high speeds, altitudes, IFR, etc), the margin of safety for the general public is much wider. The FAA puts more trust in your own assessment of your medical condition's impact on your safety, since the main person affected by your ADM in such an aircraft is yourself. editing to add that this isn't speculation, I fly gliders.

Re: What planes can you fly without a pilot’s license?

#160

Post by technick »

I once had dreams of becoming a pilot but the FAA considers adderall a no fly drug, even though it makes me better at everything I do. Because I wasn't diagnosed with it by a shrink or psychologist, the FAA doc in Oklahoma told me I could stop taking it for six months and then get my medical but there wasn't any way I could do that.

Another guy I know who was in the same boat as me, went and got his pilots license in another country (I think Australia) and just flies here without any problems.

The FAA needs to let go a little bit, otherwise more and more are going to start violating laws because we are tired of the overreach.

Update: Forgot to mention a lot of people that are getting caught up with ADHD or Adderall can go get their sports pilot license but that restricts them to ultralight planes with a max of 2 seats and very low weight limits. The good thing about the sports pilot is it doesn't require a medical.

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