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VanMoof encryption key exporter

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Re: VanMoof encryption key exporter

#71

Post by blackbeans »

jjav wrote: post #14
ano-ther wrote: post #8

Honest question: what’s the appeal of a bike that needs an internet connection & app to unlock?

> Honest question: what’s the appeal of a bike that needs an internet connection & app to unlock? I struggle to understand those who think something like that could be a good idea. Isn't it obvious that an app will not be around for as long as a bike can last? I have a bike from the early 90s, that's over 30 years. Does anyone think an app will be around even for 10 years, let alone 30+?

While what you are saying is true and the market is moving towards long term solutions because of environmental reasons, at the moment the lifespan of electric components in bikes is usually set at 5 years with 2 years of warranty for the consumer.

Bikes are made of aluminium these days instead of steel, which gives them a lifespan of about 10 years, certainly not 30.

If you buy an ebike, you must be prepared for maintenance and replacement of parts. That's the state of the market right now.

I agree that making an app mandatory for a bike is a bad idea, and I would never buy such a solution. However this is an urban city design bike, aimed at a specific group of customers who do value these kind of innovations.

Re: VanMoof encryption key exporter

#72

Post by mimischi »

jtwaleson wrote: post #42
yabatopia wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Going from Vanmoof to Cowboy Bikes is like switching from the plague to cholera. Same modus operandi: excessively VC funded, lots of hype, proprietary parts, mounting losses, loosing money with every sale, ... and it's getting worse every year. Cowboy Bikes is just another bankruptcy waiting to happen.

I'm riding a Cowboy right now, and I chose it because they didn't have the service and quality issues that Vanmoof had. I've been very happy with it and hope they will not go under. I was annoyed with the app but I created a bluetooth key fob so I don't have to use the app to unlock it. Now I'm even happier with my daily rides. That being said: if I were in the market today I think I'd go for the Veloretti Ace. Less…

Care to share more details on that bluetooth fob? Thanks!

Re: VanMoof encryption key exporter

#73

Post by foepys »

estomagordo wrote: post #65
mattio wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure why everyone thinks they are expensive. Just the bike is about 2000 euro. There are eBikes costing 4000 euro. My van moof was about 2800 because I bought the 2 packages taking care of theft and repairs. Because of their image I never have to lock the bike besides their amazing kick lock bike, so getting on and off the bike with locking and unlocking it is a matter of seconds. This is not expensive at al…

> This is not expensive at all. I mean, you can get a regular bike for €300, €700 if you want to splurge. But of course, the downside of that would be that you'd get more exercise.

Have the prices come down lately? When COVID hit, it was nearly impossible to find cheap new bikes.

Re: VanMoof encryption key exporter

#74

Post by prmoustache »

RajT88 wrote: post #43
jjav wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Honest question: what’s the appeal of a bike that needs an internet connection & app to unlock? I struggle to understand those who think something like that could be a good idea. Isn't it obvious that an app will not be around for as long as a bike can last? I have a bike from the early 90s, that's over 30 years. Does anyone think an app will be around even for 10 years, let alone 30+?

A buddy of mine is a hardcore rider. He goes through a $5k bike every 5 years or so. Could he refurb the titanium frames for newer parts? Maybe. At some point racing tech moves on and you need a newer frame for the latest and greatest stuff to fit.

Your friend just want a new bike every few years, he doesn't go through it. I have been in that place. That doesn't mean older stuff becomes unrideable and unfixable.

You can find parts for nearly any kind of old/obsolete bike technology ever made in volume, even tires for odd wheel sizes that have been mostly abandonned can still be found.

Re: VanMoof encryption key exporter

#75

Post by fragile_frogs »

fermentation wrote: post #4

I'm just now hearing about VanMoof failing. This is surprising, considering these bikes seem to have pretty meh build quality and are being priced much higher than one would expect.

I ride BMX, road bikes and Mountain Bikes. I've tried a VanMoof two years ago and the build quality was terrible. You couldn't pay me to ride one.

Re: VanMoof encryption key exporter

#76

Post by holoduke »

mattio wrote: post #56
Arnt wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What did Van Moof make, exactly? Do you think they were normal bikes? They made expensive e-bikes with theft recovery features. They have features that make it possible to trace and locate them, and Van Moof would actually do this. For people who spend €3-4k on an easily stolen object that the police won't care about, that's a unique selling point.

I am not sure why everyone thinks they are expensive. Just the bike is about 2000 euro. There are eBikes costing 4000 euro. My van moof was about 2800 because I bought the 2 packages taking care of theft and repairs. Because of their image I never have to lock the bike besides their amazing kick lock bike, so getting on and off the bike with locking and unlocking it is a matter of seconds. This is not expensive at al…

They are expensive. All parts are cheap chinese crap components. I had to dismantle the main motor because some slip ring got worn out. Turned out to be a cheap motor you can find in parts on Alibaba/expess. The brakes are bad. The electronics are bad. They almost always fail after a while. The only thing what is good about VanMoof are the looks. Everything else is just shit.

Re: VanMoof encryption key exporter

#77

Post by estomagordo »

foepys wrote: post #73
estomagordo wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is not expensive at all. I mean, you can get a regular bike for €300, €700 if you want to splurge. But of course, the downside of that would be that you'd get more exercise.

Have the prices come down lately? When COVID hit, it was nearly impossible to find cheap new bikes.

I bought a new bike for €300 something in 2021, in NL. But it does seem like some stores hardly carry anything that costs below €1000.

Re: VanMoof encryption key exporter

#78

Post by benoliver999 »

jskrablin wrote: post #52
benoliver999 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worry about this with most components of e-bikes. I suppose a mid-drive one is probably always gonna have parts you can replace but custom kit like VanMoof seems ready for landfill.

You should be able to get years of support for established brands. They are all using similar/identical components (Shimano, Yamaha, Bafang mid drive motors, similar battery packs, etc). There's also aftermarket support/custmizations available for them. Going with a small/exotic brand will always carry a risk of brand disappearing, no aftermarket options, hard to get spare parts, etc... And e-bike business is especia…

Yeah I look at e.g. Bosch and it looks like a standardised size and fit. Bit ugly but removable and replaceable.

Re: VanMoof encryption key exporter

#79

Post by onion2k »

gnopgnip wrote: post #10
ano-ther wrote: post #8

Honest question: what’s the appeal of a bike that needs an internet connection & app to unlock?

If it’s stolen they will either recover it or replace it. And everyone knows this, so no one will buy a stolen one and they are less likely to be stolen.

Not any more, so owners will probably need to be a bit more careful now.

Re: VanMoof encryption key exporter

#80

Post by moooo99 »

estomagordo wrote: post #65
mattio wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure why everyone thinks they are expensive. Just the bike is about 2000 euro. There are eBikes costing 4000 euro. My van moof was about 2800 because I bought the 2 packages taking care of theft and repairs. Because of their image I never have to lock the bike besides their amazing kick lock bike, so getting on and off the bike with locking and unlocking it is a matter of seconds. This is not expensive at al…

> This is not expensive at all. I mean, you can get a regular bike for €300, €700 if you want to splurge. But of course, the downside of that would be that you'd get more exercise.

I mean, you can also easily spend >2k on a bike. In terms of e-bikes the prices for Vanmoof and their competitor Cowboy aren’t particularly cheap, but they aren’t incredibly out of line either.
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