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Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

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171–180 of 413 posts

Re: Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

#171

IMO, they should consider banning cars in downtown areas (and adding large parking garages just outside them) while they're at it.

They've banned new parking places in Cambridge. They're not fixing the red line or adding parking outside of the city. They're just not allowing more parking inside.

So I have the option of paying $700 a month to park in town or take a bus that only comes by once every hour and then get jammed on a subway car that might even make it to it's destination.

Re: Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

#172
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

more supply = more competition, no?

I have never seen more supply of apartments make existing rents go down. I had a friend's rent go up 25% in one year in an area that has seen a huge amount of apartment buildings go up. That's not rational. The companies that own these apartment buildings care about nothing more than more money and know that they'll be able to find someone to pay the exhorbant prices.

You didn't live in the world where the extra supply of apartments didn't exist. Maybe the rents didn't go down, but you don't know how high they would have gotten.

Positive effects can exist even if they don't singlehandedly flip a decades long trend.

Re: Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

#173
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Donuted buildings will forever remind me of the Ponte Tower building. (1) https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2017/02/th...

In Hong Kong, pre-handover, I stayed in a windowless hotel room.

I love to sleep in darkness. Stayed at an Airbnb with a windowless bedroom. Best sleep I ever had.

Re: Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

#174
post #84
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because that would convert space really badly. If you're making 10'x10' rooms out of a 100'x100' space, it's 74% dead space. If a floor is more than 10,000 sq feet, maybe 40,000 sq feet, it goes up to to 90%. I mean, numbers are made up, but the point holds.

I’d be interested to see people get really creative with it. Throw a gym in on one floor. Cinema room on another. Storage units in a few more. Probably difficult to structurally support a pool on a floor not already designed for one but sure, let’s throw one in there too. A kids playroom is maybe a little depressing with no natural light but it could work. Hell: keep the middle commercial space and put a grocery stor…

20 Exchange in NYC is like that. Each chunk of floors gets a nearby amenities pod, with singletons for the really expensive stuff. Still, I think you’d have to get a screaming deal on the building in order to be able to make that economical.

Re: Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

#175

There was a cool OddLots episode recently where they talked to a guy who does Office to Residential work and some of the complexity. One thing he talked about, which I didn't know anyone did, was to actually cut through the ceiling/floorplate of buildings to basically "donut" them. This is necessary because many office floorplans are huge with modern HVAC and when converted into residential you end up with either und…

For buildings where they can't cut the whole center of the building... maybe cutting more (but smaller) holes part way between the outside and the center would work. Then do vertical gardens up those shafts.

The issue is emergency egress. You need those shafts to be able to support external staircases with many dozens of people rushing down simultaneously in the event of a fire.

Re: Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

#176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood the need to concentrate all the offices in the single focal point of the city. And currently with WFH it seems to make even more sense to distribute office spaces in local "co-working" spaces and in the end mix residential with work making it intertwined (zoning in the USA, from what I understand, is weird as hack…)

For professions or companies where in-person collaboration is still needed, bigger concentration of business helps focus infrastructure investment into areas where it is most impactful. For instance, it's easier to make a subway line go through an area with lots of offices than it would be to have multiple separate lines passing through satellite hubs.

This stuff is mostly not centrally planned. People are free to open up offices wherever zoning allows (which is generally a lot more places than the few ultra-concentrated areas like downtown Manhattan), yet they tend to concentrate. Perhaps highly concentrating workers and businesses creates the best conditions for free movement of workers between businesses, allowing the best companies to more easily find the best workers.

Re: Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

#177

I hope we don't just settle for substandard housing cobbled together from ADUs and converted office buildings... I would like to see governments stepping up to raise the funds to buy out neighborhoods at a fair price and converting them into efficient, humane urban areas. You take what you can get, but in my area it seems most new housing is either smashed up against a freeway or a mish-mash of car-dependent ADUs. Fu…

converting office buildings do not preclude designing humane urban areas

Did you interpret my comment as suggesting that it does?

Re: Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

#178
post #26

There's a very good NYT article with great visualizations on the process of and obstacles to converting office buildings to residential: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2023/03/11/upshot/office...

I find it interesting people converted factories and workshops and such into housing (lofts etc) but developing places built for humans is somehow harder. I feel like most of this is FUD for redevelopment subsidies by developers. A good friend is a Gehry apprenticed professor of architecture that specialized in sky scrapers, residential and commercial, and he thinks it’s technically not a challenge. They are built with drop ceilings and modularity built in mind so segmenting into smaller spaces with plumbing and other amenities isn’t a challenge. Most offer floor to ceiling windows around a core of elevator banks so the “no windows” thing is on the surface absurd.

Re: Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

#179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most office buildings are not architecturally feasible to convert to residential. In fact, because of zoning laws, many/most can't even be converted. Would you live in an apartment 15 feet wide and 50 feet deep? No. That's why most office buildings dont work You have to redo all the mechanical, plumbing, electric, and then entirely refinish the building. Its literally cheaper to build new than deal with the nightmare…

>Would you live in an apartment 15 feet wide and 50 feet deep? For laughs, I just measured the width of my home's hallways and rooms. I don't see why 15x50 feet apartment isn't doable especially for a bachelor/new couple starting out. Assume an apartment with a 3 foot wide, 50 foot length hallway, subtract another 2 feet width for walls/piping/whatever, and then you can hang 5 rooms that are 10x10 feet from the hallw…

All of your windows are on one of the 15 ft walls. You would need to have the lights on all day in many of the rooms, no opening a window for fresh air, limited escape options in case of emergency. Perhaps some of these concerns should be weighed against the reality of housing shortage and homelessness, but ample windows throughout is the standard for residential today. That’s why modern office tower conversion involves cutting the center out for a light shaft.

Re: Boston mayor announces residential conversion program for office buildings

#180

When I read this my immediate reaction is this is part of Boston's effort to blunt the impact of the potential incoming commercial real estate crash, which could damage many Boston business as well as Boston's commercial tax base. I was surprised not to see that mentioned at all in the announcement. Is it unrelated? Is the announcement political spin to encourage those who might otherwise be against bailing out comme…

I don't think it's related to any crisis in CRE. Rather it's related to an ongoing crisis in housing. Boston is short 30 thousand housing units.

Yes CRE vacancy is high in Boston, but it's still far from being a CRE crisis. The share of biotech and healthcare space is so high within Boston CRE that vacancy rate aren't nearly as bad as in other cities. And lab conversions are increasingly commonplace, so it's not like a residential conversion program was necessary to save CRE.

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