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Sao Paulo: A city with no outdoor advertisements (2013)

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Re: Sao Paulo: A city with no outdoor advertisements (2013)

#211

Post by usefulcat »

dahart wrote: post #135
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's considered a radical stance, but I +1. Ads should just be banned anywhere in general. They concentrate power to those who already have it, because you can make more ads if you have more money. The local burger joint cannot compete against macdonals on advertising, the local soda against coca cola. It's ugly, eat attention, and interrupt. It creates business models with terrible incentives, which leads to censo…

> That’s considered a radical stance I don’t think so. I think business wants us to feel that way, while the average person would choose to not hear/watch/see ads given the choice. I’m not necessarily against advertising, and regardless it’s a fact that advertising drives our economy and as a whole we generally don’t know how to create and conduct business without advertising. But I am against the notion that not wan…

> it’s a fact that advertising drives our economy

Is it really though? I could believe that advertising does incentivize people to buy things that they otherwise might not. But OTOH, if there were no advertising, people would still spend money, just differently. It's not as though people are going to start lighting money on fire in the absence of advertising.

Re: Sao Paulo: A city with no outdoor advertisements (2013)

#212

Post by mcpackieh »

ffgjgf1 wrote: post #167
mymythisisthis wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The funny thing is, the classical art of Greece, probably looked much different than how we think about it. It was much more colorful and vibrant, it's just that all the pigment washed away. https://www.ancient-origins.net/sites/default/files/styles/l... Cities adding art back onto the walls, is probably closer to how the ancient Greek cities actually looked. Our classical architectural view of pristine white walls i…

I refuse to believe that the people who made some of the best ancient statues had an artistic sense of a 5-year old when it came to color... Obviously ancient status were colored but probably in a much nicer way. No way something like: https://static.frieze.com/files/inline-images/web-cg-h-102-a... could be even close to the original ( considering that the Romans generally managed to somehow get skin tones more or le…

The problem is they do careful analysis of statues and find evidence of pigmentation, but obviously they're only looking at the remnants of the base coat and don't see any of the careful detailing that almost certainly went towards making these statues look very lifelike (judging by the realistic quality of the sculpture itself.) And so the recreations look flat and uncanny because they're essentially unfinished.

Re: Sao Paulo: A city with no outdoor advertisements (2013)

#213

Post by mcpackieh »

soapdog wrote: post #147
Luctct wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Neither murals nor graffiti is art. None of those would have been accepted in any gallery some 30~40 years ago when standards were higher and the world didn't suffer from the high number of grown-up men who are hooked up on comic books and animated cartoons it suffers through today. A lot of it is just vandalism. None of it seems to be made by or for adults. 99% looks like it's made by some comic book fan on LSD. Alw…

As someone who graduated from an art school, let me be another voice here to say that you're absolutely wrong. Art is about intentionality and process. Duchamp and Wahrol are prime mainstream examples of that. The intervention in urban equipment is art. Making it yours, sharing it with the world, the dialectical dialogue between the mural and the surrounding cityscape, there is so much to unpack here. Also, comic boo…

I don't want a neo-Duchamp putting a port-a-potty in my neighborhood and spitefully calling it art.

Re: Sao Paulo: A city with no outdoor advertisements (2013)

#214

Post by mymythisisthis »

mcpackieh wrote: post #212
ffgjgf1 wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I refuse to believe that the people who made some of the best ancient statues had an artistic sense of a 5-year old when it came to color... Obviously ancient status were colored but probably in a much nicer way. No way something like: https://static.frieze.com/files/inline-images/web-cg-h-102-a... could be even close to the original ( considering that the Romans generally managed to somehow get skin tones more or le…

The problem is they do careful analysis of statues and find evidence of pigmentation, but obviously they're only looking at the remnants of the base coat and don't see any of the careful detailing that almost certainly went towards making these statues look very lifelike (judging by the realistic quality of the sculpture itself.) And so the recreations look flat and uncanny because they're essentially unfinished.

I wonder if another problem might be fashion trends. Sometimes bright, contrasting, colours are in style and feel normal. https://www.apparelsearch.com/terms/images/cher-aerobics-leg...

Re: Sao Paulo: A city with no outdoor advertisements (2013)

#215

Post by [deleted] »

Luctct wrote: post #173
fesoliveira wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, good thing art is subjective. To me these are leagues better than ads and they bring social commentary and inspiration far more than any ad. It's one of the few things I am proud of as someone who lived in the state of Sao Paulo for a good chunk of my life.

No, they don't bring any social commentary, they only bring sycophancy. As soon as you criticize it you are moderated and silenced into oblivion. Your "social commentary" can only go in the way they demand that it go.

[deleted]

Re: Sao Paulo: A city with no outdoor advertisements (2013)

#216

Post by ygjb »

Luctct wrote: post #178
Luctct wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

RobotCaleb, kindly explain: 1. Why are you admonishing me and not saying a word to the poster who said "check out the following books if you want to move past your misconceptions"? Why doesn't that come across as patronizing to you? 2. Why is art subjective but "the following books" are not? 3. Where did you get the idea that art is supposed to be inclusive? Kindergarten teachers routinely invited my mother to go the…

On point 3, well, yes. If your mother or teacher wanted to, and had the means and opportunity to do so. Whether or not you find artistic merit in those drawings has little bearing on the expression of pride that might drive your parent or teacher to publish that art. It doesn't have any bearing on the feelings that are evoked by the observer, whether it's your revulsion at your own productions, or the delight from normal folks when seeing displays of public art.

You said "Real art is deep, meaningful, timeless and doesn't need to be imposed."

Sand Mandalas are deeply meaningful, but completely timeless - most are created to be destroyed, often within days or hours of completion. Brueghel's Flatterers is a relatively crass, surface level, but lasting commentary on what we often refer to as Musk fanboys and such these days :P

Fundamentally, art is human expression, and your attempts to gatekeep that have fallen pretty flat so far.

Re: Sao Paulo: A city with no outdoor advertisements (2013)

#217

Post by usefulcat »

abdullahkhalids wrote: post #193
npteljes wrote: post #71

As an individual, I'd welcome no advertisements everywhere. I think ads were abused long enough. It's just a leech on the human life.

Most public advertisement is for consumption goods - food, clothes, tech gadgets etc. 1. People have mostly fixed amounts of money for these products. So the role of ads is to influence which brands/products people spend their money on. 10-20% of the cost of coke/pepsi cans is just the cost of ads that are used to influence you buy one of two almost identical products. 2. Ads total waste of society's productive power…

> 10-20% of the cost of coke/pepsi cans is just the cost of ads

I think this is an important point. If coke and pepsi were not allowed to advertise, they could only compete on price and quality.

This is clearly a win for consumers. For coke and pepsi, maybe a small to moderate loss of revenue? But then their costs would definitely go down (no advertising spend), so it wouldn't necessarily be a net loss even for them.

Re: Sao Paulo: A city with no outdoor advertisements (2013)

#218

Post by tchaffee »

whats_a_quasar wrote: post #184
tchaffee wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love SP street art but I think most of Kobra's stuff is terrible. I did see one recently that I liked. Is it art? Yeah. Is it fine art? Yeah probably. Just not my cup of tea.

Can you say more about what you don't like about Kobra's art vs. other street art? I'm curious, not familiar with the genre!

One of his signature motifs is to put a checkerboard in everything. Do an image search for "kobra checkerboard" and you'll see. I find it a bit cliché and it doesn't appeal to my asthetics.

Re: Sao Paulo: A city with no outdoor advertisements (2013)

#220

Post by rajnathani »

The LED ad billboards on Times Square obviously look cool (obviously a bad counterexample), which is a walking only/primary area. Thus, if there’s ever a law to outlaw outdoor advertisements, that the focus could be on parts of a city/town/area which are more car/roads focused, or near tranquil places like parks, and otherwise (thus to spare squares-like exceptional places like Times Square).
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