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The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

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Re: The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

#231

Post by mcpackieh »

throwanem wrote: post #158
mcpackieh wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd still rather eat at ten places that have those than one place that has you. If my making a scene makes other customers upset, then it's working. I know businesses hate it when people do this, and that's why I know it's an effective tactic. The whole point of the protest is to sabotage the business by making everybody else in the room upset.

The only person unclear on who the asshole is here is you.

Acting like an asshole is the means of protest I consciously choose. Another commenter here chooses to put stickers over the QR codes instead; I think that's pretty clever and I applaud that, but I prefer to keep it strictly legal. Stickers are technically vandalism, but ruining your day by acting like an asshole is completely legal and very effective.

Re: The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

#232

Post by flybrand »

luuurker wrote: post #230

Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn redirect me to the login page without ever showing me the content. I guess they don't like my ISP. Since I'm not going to create an account, now I just avoid their links when searching for something. Last year (I think) Twitter started showing a login/registration popup as soon we started scrolling. Not as bad, but the popup wasn't dismissible (now it is), so for a while I also stopp…

FB regularly ‘fails’ when I attempt to log out - I don’t use the app. Recently it’s been extreme using Safari. It’s so bad it can’t be accidental. Why would the ever optimize logging out?

Re: The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

#233

Post by xwdv »

TheAngush wrote: post #186

I had an experience like this today when I tried to use GlassDoor for the first time. As a student making my first ever job applications, I wanted to see what salaries and work environments were like at particular employers. GlassDoor did the same scroll-locking tactic (so an element zapper like Ublock Origin's wouldn't resolve the issue), instructing me to register or sign in to view any information. So I registered…

> Suffice to say I will not be using GlassDoor in the future

You’ll cave eventually, they know this.

Re: The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

#234

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft »

slg wrote: post #128
lamontcg wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A nonprofit that wasn't a publicly traded company would a viable alternative model. It wouldn't need to have the same insane up-and-to-the-right incentives and drive to toxic monetization.

It doesn't have to be a nonprofit. There is nothing wrong with turning a profit. The problem is when the company's only goal is ever-increasing profit and they are willing to sacrifice the wellbeing of their employees, customers, and community to achieve it.

In the context you are using it, "profit" has a very specific meaning that's a little incongruent with what you're trying to say.

In that context, "profit" is the idea that earnings above cost are distributed to shareholders. The stock market mechanism then guarantees that companies unconcerned with that sort of profit will see someone gobble up the shares once they dip low enough (and they will), install a new board of directors, and dismantle the company for parts or some other endeavor-ending inevitability.

From a stock price perspective, it will just be too tempting.

Nonprofits are disallowed from distributing earnings above cost or any other profit mechanism. While they might have their own set of pathologies, they're immune to the one I've described, to the best of my understanding.

Re: The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

#235

Post by eddythompson80 »

mindslight wrote: post #159
duxup wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And generally users of the web want things to be free / don't want to pay directly for these utilities. I feel like we as internet users are a big part of the math here.

I'm happy paying for a few personal cloud servers, more than I need perhaps. I'm happy paying for a solid Internet connection, electricity, computers, hard drives, UPSs, etc. I'm happy for paying for VOIP PSTN connectivity, mobile connectivity, etc. With very few exceptions (mostly arising out of expedience), I do not pay for software . I honestly do wish the dynamics of the software ecosystem were different, so that…

Most of the time in the current era you're not paying for software. You're paying for software as a service. You're paying someone to take on the operational aspects of running a service because to you the value is in using the software, not in operating it. It's all opportunity cost.

Re: The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

#236

Post by kitanata »

I noticed a particularly dark pattern when I used Keeps, by Thirty Madison. They tell you, that you can cancel or pause at anytime but that is a lie. They over-prescribe their medication, and if you try to pause delivery, they automatically resume it after 3 months. You cannot pause, for longer than 3 months. If you want to cancel, you have to call them where they harass you into staying.

This is not how you should do customer retention. This is fraud. You are making intentionally difficult pathways for your customers to leave you so that you can report falsely propped up retention number to your investors, Thirty Madison. If you IPOd today, I would short the shit out of you.

This is why I reported Thirty Madison to the FTC in a consumer trade complaint and it is why I notified their investors of potential fraud over LinkedIn.

Thirty Madison is committing fraud against their investors, in my opinion and you should absolutely stay away from them as a consumer.

Re: The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

#237

Post by brookst »

sshine wrote: post #224
TheAngush wrote: post #186

I had an experience like this today when I tried to use GlassDoor for the first time. As a student making my first ever job applications, I wanted to see what salaries and work environments were like at particular employers. GlassDoor did the same scroll-locking tactic (so an element zapper like Ublock Origin's wouldn't resolve the issue), instructing me to register or sign in to view any information. So I registered…

Your expectation was that this information was free, and you got offended when you realised they trade in information and you have to pay with giving some back? This is not a dark pattern any more than giving a company like GlassDoor this information is a dark deed.

The dark pattern is not mentioning this requirement and instead position account creation as the only friction to see data, and then springing the new requirement after.

Honesty would mean telling the user upfront that the info they are looking for will be available after the set up an account and leave a review of their current employer.

Re: The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

#238

Post by mcpackieh »

luuurker wrote: post #209
mcpackieh wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. I've never scanned a QR code and I don't intend to learn how. And because the premise of a restaurant not having printed menus available is so absurd, I think I'd be compelled to stick around for a few minutes loudly insulting their business acumen before leaving (as I have done before at bars that didn't accept cash!) I consider this a service done for those who think like me but aren't brave enough to speak o…

> I've never scanned a QR That's okay. It's also okay to prefer a paper menu (I'm the same). > I don't intend to learn how I mean, no one is forced to learn, but knowing stuff is not a bad thing. It takes less time to read a QR code than to type that reply. > I'd be compelled to stick around for a few minutes loudly insulting their business What happened to calmly explain your position and then leave without giving t…

The point is to sabotage the business in a more impactful way than merely walking away. Harming employee morale, and consequently employee retention, is an effective means of protest. If the employees get a sour mood about it and give other customers worse service, all the better.

Re: The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

#239

Post by RadiozRadioz »

mcpackieh wrote: post #226
RadiozRadioz wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-GB/firefox/addon/old-reddit-re... https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/old-reddit-redirec...

This is even worse. You can't trust either Mozilla or Google to vet the extensions they publish for spyware. So you have to trust and/or verify that this extension does what it says and no more. But worse, you have to vigilantly watch the extension for any changes, even if you trust the developer today he may sell it to a spyware company at any time.

This is an open source extension, as stated in the description on both pages. The repository is linked in both, feel free to build it from source and install it locally.

You don't even need these extensions, you can set up a redirect rule in uBlock Origin (if you trust that).

I sent these extensions to remedy the stated need to manually rewrite the URL, I did not say that using these extensions is a better solution than Reddit turning off the Fuck You pattern.

Re: The 'fuck you' pattern (2021)

#240

Post by mcpackieh »

luuurker wrote: post #212
AeroNotix wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sad part is that practically all patrons that could hear you will just label you as a "Karen". The owners will not change their ways. It works for them, their client base and the vast majority of potential clients. People do not care at all whatsoever about their privacy being invaded, generally.

Imagine you go out for launch and see this random guy "loudly insulting" the staff because of some random internet stuff you don't understand or care about. Maybe you won't call the guy "Karen", but I'd be very surprised if you approved of the situation... Unless, of course, you think that insulting low paid workers loudly is something good and to be proud of.

The point is not to persuade you of my point of view, the point is to ruin the mood of the workers and customers. So if I leave you fuming about the Karen (eg me, but wrong gender fyi), mission accomplished. If it were legal I'd pull the fire alarm on my way out.
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