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Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

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Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#71

Post by mjg59 »

varjag wrote: post #12
8note wrote: post #7

> After all, they fraudulently possibly told their comrades that the United States was a lazy country that probably couldn’t even cook for itself. They need it to go out to buy pizza… This is a weird dig at the soviets, who were probs just happy to to find some customers to justify having already dug up all the ore. The fraudster seem to be the Americans in this case?

Fun fact, pizza was virtually unknown in USSR throughout its existence.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Gorbachev_Pizza_Hut_co... wasn't even screened in Russia!

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#72

Post by akira2501 »

relativ575 wrote: post #43
akira2501 wrote: post #28

The US "intelligence" apparatus created a particular cover story. There's no actual information as to what the USSR actually believed at the time. If they weren't particularly interesting in competing in aerial surveillance then it may have been seen as worth the money they got in return. They were already in the business of exporting it, it's not as if we got them to create a special market based on this cockamamie…

> If they weren't particularly interesting in competing in aerial surveillance then it may have been seen as worth the money they got in return. You really bend it to fit your narrative. Not sure what the Soviets believed, but no sane country would want to help their adversaries to achieve stronger offensive capabilities, which surveillance would no doubt help. Bribery though, that wouldn't be too outrageous. I don't…

> but no sane country would want to help their adversaries to achieve stronger offensive capabilities, which surveillance would no doubt help

This was an arms race, not a single tactical battle decision. A shrewd opponent may be able to use your new technology to internally launch development of their own. They would likely recognize that after Gary Powers you weren't performing overflights anymore. They would also have had satellite imaging, and there is some data that they did use them to image the plane during testing.

So.. you let your enemy build an expensive new toy that isn't particularly useful outside of a full scale nuclear war while you build yourself some fast new fighters and some high altitude missile technology.

Is either that, or you seemingly have to accept that the KGB could not have possibly have seen through the that titanium pizza ovens story. It's much more likely that even trying to pass this off made the entire ruse all the more obvious to them.

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#73

Post by justinclift »

relativ575 wrote: post #43
akira2501 wrote: post #28

The US "intelligence" apparatus created a particular cover story. There's no actual information as to what the USSR actually believed at the time. If they weren't particularly interesting in competing in aerial surveillance then it may have been seen as worth the money they got in return. They were already in the business of exporting it, it's not as if we got them to create a special market based on this cockamamie…

> If they weren't particularly interesting in competing in aerial surveillance then it may have been seen as worth the money they got in return. You really bend it to fit your narrative. Not sure what the Soviets believed, but no sane country would want to help their adversaries to achieve stronger offensive capabilities, which surveillance would no doubt help. Bribery though, that wouldn't be too outrageous. I don't…

> but no sane country would want to help their adversaries to achieve stronger offensive capabilities

Yet here in Australia, we're still happily selling iron ore to China. The same iron ore that gets turned into weaponry for China and its friends (among other things).

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#74

Post by throwaway_13140 »

anoy8888 wrote: post #59
nwallin wrote: post #42

Does any know any more details about this? It's a fun tidbit that gets a link/article on social media every few weeks, but it's never anything more than a tidbit. "The US needed titanium for the SR-71. The only supplier of titanium was the Soviet Union. So the US bought it from the Soviet Union through a shell corporation." But that's it. It's those 3 facts and only those three facts expressed in anywhere between one…

That is what China is doing to US now . Decades from now , Chinese will joke about how they get chips and other secret tech from shell companies in us. They will also joke about how they secretly sell drugs to America to make them useless and make society unstable.

yes - and spotted lantern flies, and lead in toothpaste, and endocrine stopping chemicals in plastic kids toys, the list goes on and on

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#75

Post by mcny »

andsoitis wrote: post #68
anoy8888 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is what China is doing to US now . Decades from now , Chinese will joke about how they get chips and other secret tech from shell companies in us. They will also joke about how they secretly sell drugs to America to make them useless and make society unstable.

> Chinese will joke about how they get chips and other secret tech from shell companies in us. They will also joke about how they secretly sell drugs to America to make them useless and make society unstable. If they’re useless, how are they making chips and secret tech?

>> Chinese will joke about how they get chips and other secret tech from shell companies in us. They will also joke about how they secretly sell drugs to America to make them useless and make society unstable.

> If they’re useless, how are they making chips and secret tech?

My reading is they are trying to make us useless but we are not there yet? I assume it takes time, right?

In any case, not like the west can complain after what we did in the opium wars?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium_Wars

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#76

Post by pkaye »

missedthecue wrote: post #41
ezzaf wrote: post #22

Perhaps a more accurate headline would have been this buried deeper in the article "The US worked through Third World countries and fake companies and finally was able to ship the ore to the US to build the SR-71." And to complete the loop, Russia is now importing sanctioned American microchips for its missiles via third parties. I wonder if the order form states they will be used in smart pizzas ovens.

80% of the world's silicon and magnesium comes from Russia/China. US can't make the stealth coating on the F-35 without it. Can't control where the big bang placed mineral deposits... *Technically silicon is everywhere but until the US and EU are willing to rip up their riverbeds to get at it, it's as good as nonexistent there.

The purest silicon for semiconductor wafers comes from Spruce Pine, North Carolina.

https://www.bbc.com/future/bespoke/made-on-earth/how-the-chi...

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#77

Post by mechanical_bear »

mcny wrote: post #75
andsoitis wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Chinese will joke about how they get chips and other secret tech from shell companies in us. They will also joke about how they secretly sell drugs to America to make them useless and make society unstable. If they’re useless, how are they making chips and secret tech?

>> Chinese will joke about how they get chips and other secret tech from shell companies in us. They will also joke about how they secretly sell drugs to America to make them useless and make society unstable. > If they’re useless, how are they making chips and secret tech? My reading is they are trying to make us useless but we are not there yet? I assume it takes time, right? In any case, not like the west can comp…

What “we” did? Speak for yourself sir.

Re: Soviet Union sold titanium to US believing they needed it for pizza ovens

#78

Post by azathough »

mcny wrote: post #75
andsoitis wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Chinese will joke about how they get chips and other secret tech from shell companies in us. They will also joke about how they secretly sell drugs to America to make them useless and make society unstable. If they’re useless, how are they making chips and secret tech?

>> Chinese will joke about how they get chips and other secret tech from shell companies in us. They will also joke about how they secretly sell drugs to America to make them useless and make society unstable. > If they’re useless, how are they making chips and secret tech? My reading is they are trying to make us useless but we are not there yet? I assume it takes time, right? In any case, not like the west can comp…

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