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Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

theregister.com

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Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#31

Post by throwaway_ab »

Many people are saying Tesla FSD is far more advanced, and I've seen videos of A Tesla driving around LA for 2 hours completely autonomously so I agree Tesla FSD is the world leader by far and blows what Mercedes has built out of the water.

However Mercedes are taking liability whilst their system is in use which implies Tesla takes no liability whilst their system is in use.

I'm surprised Tesla is scared to take legal responsibility for their system and I am surprised lawmakers are allowing autonomous systems when the manufacturer doesn't believe in it enough to take responsibility whilst it's in use.

How is Tesla getting away with this?

Of course they can beat the competition especially if they do not need to take legal responsibility for any deaths/accidents that occur when it's in use.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#32

Post by zaroth »

Arainach wrote: post #20
diebeforei485 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You aren't going to kill people while going under 40mph on a highway (cars only, no pedestrians) anyway. Under 40mph is like stop and go traffic. This is a marketing stunt. They've taken a well-solved problem (stop and go) and taken responsibility for it, and getting headlines by screaming something about J3016 level 3.

A highway is any public road per legal definition. https://law.justia.com/codes/california/2022/code-veh/divisi... 40mph is more than enough to kill someone.

“Limited access highway” is a different thing, and that’s the roads this system will engage on. Zero pedestrians, unless you know, a climate protest is shutting it down.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#33

Post by Retric »

dbcurtis wrote: post #9

L3 is profoundly unwise. L3 can disengage at any moment. The attention required of the human in order to drive safely exceeds that required in L2, and is much more difficult to maintain.

L3 requires zero attention, that’s what makes it L3 vs L2. The driver needs to stay sober, awake, and in the drivers seat but are supposed to be able to read a book or something.

A L3 car is required to be able to handle all short term situations and only do a handoff with 5-10 seconds of warning. The idea is it’s ok for the car to come to a complete stop and say I have no idea what to do, but it isn’t ok to simply fail on a freeway at 70 MPH.

Failing safely is a huge difference, as mentioned in the article: if a driver doesn't take over when prompted the car activates the hazard lights and slowly comes to a stop before making an emergency system call to alert first responders to a potential problem.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#34

Post by justapassenger »

lvl102 wrote: post #29

It doesn’t take a lot to retro-fit roads with autonomous guardrail markers when we repave. It’s going to take a federal-level effort to accomplish this (which should have been apart of pandemic infrastructure stimulus). I strongly believe this would improve safety for autonomous vehicles by 1000x.

Detecting lane is mostly solved problem. Detecting AND predicting what other things will do on the road (not only cars, but people, animals, trash, etc) is not.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#35

Post by zaroth »

ethanbond wrote: post #5
porphyra wrote: post #3

... only when driving under 40 mph on highways. So it is pretty useless. The main thing is that Mercedes Benz will take liability for anything that goes wrong. But the system as a whole is far less capable than Tesla FSD.

> but the system as a whole is far less capable than Tesla FSD, the renowned “exaggerator” told me so We actually have no idea what Benz et al.’s systems are capable of if they were to deploy them with the same recklessness as Tesla.

This statement makes no logical sense. Their systems are “capable of” what they can be used to achieve in actual operation.

It’s not like it’s this massively sophisticated system for FSD with most of the code commented out.

These are purpose-built and heavily tested to a specification - that’s how engineering works. The Mercedes system specification is extremely limited in practice, but gives them the marketing win of being able to claim they do L3.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#36

Post by simondotau »

justapassenger wrote: post #24
megaman821 wrote: post #12

Headlines like this really speed up the decline of media. While it is factual it really exploits what a common person would interpret the headline to mean. Tesla is exploring autonomous driving on most roads and conditions. L3 autonomous driving is not binary, you can get it at certain times, in certain places, under certain weather conditions yet the comparison is anchoring it to a system that isn't aiming to operat…

Mercedes shipped a system that’s legally self driving, under some set of conditions. Tesla sells system that’s not legally self driving under any set of conditions. You’re always driving, and Tesla will fight you in court if you want them to take liability for any action it took. There’s nothing misleading about this headline.

All of that is technically correct but isn’t the point the OP was making. These are products with wildly different aspirations and at different stages of achieving those aspirations.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#37

Post by notyourwork »

throwaway_ab wrote: post #31

Many people are saying Tesla FSD is far more advanced, and I've seen videos of A Tesla driving around LA for 2 hours completely autonomously so I agree Tesla FSD is the world leader by far and blows what Mercedes has built out of the water. However Mercedes are taking liability whilst their system is in use which implies Tesla takes no liability whilst their system is in use. I'm surprised Tesla is scared to take leg…

If I were Tesla why would I take responsibility for something no one is forcing me to take responsibility for? Lawmakers are responsible for this charade and its embarrassing to me that a company can be so misleading with marketing and get away with it.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#38

Post by dmbche »

megaman821 wrote: post #12

Headlines like this really speed up the decline of media. While it is factual it really exploits what a common person would interpret the headline to mean. Tesla is exploring autonomous driving on most roads and conditions. L3 autonomous driving is not binary, you can get it at certain times, in certain places, under certain weather conditions yet the comparison is anchoring it to a system that isn't aiming to operat…

I'm not a fan of tesla, but not a fan of self driving over all. This headline just tells me that benz is the first to be selling legal automatic driving cars in California, something I assumed Tesla was doing. I found it enlightening.

Non technical people would probably assume that Tesla already has this, since we hear about it all the time, and that this is Benz getting up to speed - while it's not the case at all and Benz is beating the largest competitor in the market.

I think this is a fair title.

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#39

Post by pyinstallwoes »

cj wrote: post #27
belter wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://youtu.be/BFdWsJs6z4c

I'm aware of Elon's opinion: "LiDAR is lame. LiDAR is lame. Lame. Losers use LiDAR. LiDAR is expensive." I can't stomach watching a video that starts out like that.

Do you use LiDAR when you drive?

Re: Mercedes beats Tesla to autonomous driving in California

#40

Post by dmbche »

simondotau wrote: post #28
megaman821 wrote: post #12

Headlines like this really speed up the decline of media. While it is factual it really exploits what a common person would interpret the headline to mean. Tesla is exploring autonomous driving on most roads and conditions. L3 autonomous driving is not binary, you can get it at certain times, in certain places, under certain weather conditions yet the comparison is anchoring it to a system that isn't aiming to operat…

[flagged]

I doubt so, I think in the guidelines Meta comments are not encouraged as they are not fruitful for conversation.
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