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Proposed SEC order to freeze, repatriate Binance.US assets

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Re: Proposed SEC order to freeze, repatriate Binance.US assets

#591

Post by greatwave1 »

EscapeFromNY wrote: post #588
greatwave1 wrote: post #585

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The paper literally says, "75% of the real bitcoin volume has been linked to exchanges or exchange-like entities" Which is an entirely different metric than the % of bitcoin volume that's speculation. If I link a paper that says "1% of squirrels are albino", and I claim that it says that 1% of bitcoin trading is speculative, then I'm not "bringing objective data to the conversation"... I'm just lying My original co…

> Which is an entirely different metric Of course not. If you disagree, at least try to present a coherent argument instead of just talking about squirrels. What entities do you think are missing from the list: exchanges or exchange-like entities such as on-line wallets, OTC desks, and large institutional traders That might be overcounting even, since online wallets have nothing to do with speculation. So I'll correc…

I'm sorry, I was under the impression that you at least had a basic understanding of cryptocurrencies and the drivers of transaction volume.

If you don't even understand that speculation can (and does) occur outside of on-exchange transactions, then I don't think this conversation is worth continuing.

I now understand that you probably weren't lying, you were just clueless about what you were talking about and actually thought that exchange volume is the only place where speculation occurs lmao.

In case it still isn't clear to you: on-exchange activity != total speculative activity. It isn't an upper threshold on total speculative activity. It has no concrete relationship with total speculative activity. Both on-exchange and off-exchange transactions can be speculative, or non-speculative. The metric you provided is not "exactly the data I asked for", it's a complete non-sequitur that betrays your ignorance on the underlying topic.

> That doesn't sound too different from all modern investing.

This is a valid comparison, you're on the right track here! Crypto ownership is very similar to modern investing, in that it's a speculative asset class, and not primarily being used for its function as a currency.

Re: Proposed SEC order to freeze, repatriate Binance.US assets

#592

Post by flangola7 »

zirgs wrote: post #409
flangola7 wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What the real hell? I would report most well off people for dodging taxes, I would never report someone for drugs.

What if that person was selling drugs to children?

Depends on the drug and the age of the child.

Re: Proposed SEC order to freeze, repatriate Binance.US assets

#593

Post by emodendroket »

concordDance wrote: post #410
flangola7 wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other than the data outlier of the US basically no nation considers hate speech to be free speech. The US has plenty of asinine speech restrictions too that no one seems to find a 1st amendment problem with, like broadcasting a recent marvel film on my own personal website.

The requirement on communication providers to police the speech of people using them is just insane and I am still gobsmacked it's what has happened.

Who’s requiring them? Nobody in the US if that’s where they’re operating. The issue is that that content is so off-putting to the average person that it kills the platform. Nobody is hanging around a site full of hate speech unless that’s specifically what they’re looking for.

Re: Proposed SEC order to freeze, repatriate Binance.US assets

#594

Post by EscapeFromNY »

greatwave1 wrote: post #591
EscapeFromNY wrote: post #588

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Which is an entirely different metric Of course not. If you disagree, at least try to present a coherent argument instead of just talking about squirrels. What entities do you think are missing from the list: exchanges or exchange-like entities such as on-line wallets, OTC desks, and large institutional traders That might be overcounting even, since online wallets have nothing to do with speculation. So I'll correc…

I'm sorry, I was under the impression that you at least had a basic understanding of cryptocurrencies and the drivers of transaction volume. If you don't even understand that speculation can (and does) occur outside of on-exchange transactions, then I don't think this conversation is worth continuing. I now understand that you probably weren't lying, you were just clueless about what you were talking about and actual…

If you replaced the subject matter with something more mundane, this exchange would be hilarious. It almost reminds me of a Monty Python sketch.

1> Here's a paper that calculates the average lifespan of humans. The average lifespan is 75 years.

2> That's because the vast majority of humans eat junk food lmao. What do you think the lifespan of a human is? I'd be willing to be it's less than 10 years, maybe even 100 years

1> You don't have to bet, the data is in the paper. 75 years.

2> The paper only looks at the Americas, Eurasia, Africa, and mainland Australia. It doesn't even look at Tasmania. You're making up bogus statistics that aren't supported by your sources in the way that you say they are.

1> Maybe so. I put forward my sources, but there could be a better way of calculating it. If you had to calculate that same statistic, what methodology would you use?

2> One time I saw someone die from a heart attack when they were 45 years old, and 45 is way less than 75. Why would I spend my time digging up data to quantify things are incredibly obvious from observation, when you're willing to lie and make up facts to support your narrative?

1> Your personal observations are not universal objective reality. That's why data is important when running a society at scale. Why exactly do you believe the inclusion of data from Tasmania would significantly change the results? Do you have any sources for your wild claims?

2> I'm sorry, I was under the impression that you at least had a basic understanding of geography. If you don't even understand that humans live in Tasmania, then I don't think this conversation is worth continuing. When talking about the lifespan of humans on earth, the lifespan of humans in most countries on earth is a complete non-sequitur.

Anyway, if you don't understand why data is important when discussing policy, there's not much to be gained here. I hope you find truth if you're looking for it, and peace otherwise. Cheers.

Re: Proposed SEC order to freeze, repatriate Binance.US assets

#595

Post by greatwave1 »

EscapeFromNY wrote: post #594
greatwave1 wrote: post #591

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry, I was under the impression that you at least had a basic understanding of cryptocurrencies and the drivers of transaction volume. If you don't even understand that speculation can (and does) occur outside of on-exchange transactions, then I don't think this conversation is worth continuing. I now understand that you probably weren't lying, you were just clueless about what you were talking about and actual…

If you replaced the subject matter with something more mundane, this exchange would be hilarious. It almost reminds me of a Monty Python sketch. 1> Here's a paper that calculates the average lifespan of humans. The average lifespan is 75 years. 2> That's because the vast majority of humans eat junk food lmao. What do you think the lifespan of a human is? I'd be willing to be it's less than 10 years, maybe even 100 ye…

What a ridiculous analogy. Add statistics to the pile of topics that you're overconfident yet completely naive about.

What you're describing is a scenario where you take a sample, and use its measure of central distribution to make inferences about SAME METRIC in the population. This is perfectly valid!

But the obvious flaw with your argument isn't "this paper says that 75% of X volume is speculation, but it's excluding some data", it's that the paper presents literally no claims or evidence about the % of volume that is speculation lmao.

You have been conflating 2 entirely unrelated metrics this whole time. I said this before, but I guess it needs repeating: the % of volume that happens on-exchange is not a proxy for the % of volume that is speculation. These are completely different things!

If you want an accurate analogy, this would be like if you said "this paper shows that the average human lifespan is 4 years", but what the paper actually said was that the Olympics are held every 4 years. It's a completely unrelated data point, irrelevant to the topic at hand, and you'd have to either be ignorant or intentionally deceitful to pretend that they are the same thing.

Just bush league stuff... and as I said earlier, if you can't grasp this concept then I don't know what you're doing on a crypto thread.

I actually do think that you have serious underlying confusion about the nature of what speculation even is, because you keep pretending like it's something which can be objectively measured by using on-chain data. Data is obviously a useful tool when it's available, but making up bullshit statistics to support your argument is malignant.

Re: Proposed SEC order to freeze, repatriate Binance.US assets

#596

Post by School-Cotton »

derefr wrote: post #586
School-Cotton wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Steam but where you actually own, and so can resell, your game licenses. This is already possible and always has been. The reason steam and the game studios haven’t implemented it is because it wasn’t in their interest to do so, not because they didn’t have the technology to.

No, it wouldn't have been possible. Because nobody (read: secondary-market game collectors) is willing to be on the other side of that deal and actually value these transferrable game licenses to the degree that they value physical games. Because, in turn, the hypothetical little by-fiat "federation" of companies willing to honor it could just decide to renege on the deal at any time and stop honoring it. (Which woul…

Even if there was a blockchain, Steam still has to decide to honor it, because they’re the ones who physically decide whether you get to play the game, or not. Nothing prevents them from choosing not to honor transfers that appear on the blockchain after a particular date, thus effectively switching back to a centralized database system.

Re: Proposed SEC order to freeze, repatriate Binance.US assets

#597

Post by concordDance »

emodendroket wrote: post #593
concordDance wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The requirement on communication providers to police the speech of people using them is just insane and I am still gobsmacked it's what has happened.

Who’s requiring them? Nobody in the US if that’s where they’re operating. The issue is that that content is so off-putting to the average person that it kills the platform. Nobody is hanging around a site full of hate speech unless that’s specifically what they’re looking for.

In Europe. The UK, Germany, France, etc.

Actually, even in the US communication providers are required to stop people sending certain images to each other.

Re: Proposed SEC order to freeze, repatriate Binance.US assets

#598

Post by rvz »

Eisenstein wrote: post #395
rvz wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. For example there is this with Stellar [0] which is certainly a use case for sending money across the world into crypto wallets, same day, near instant and very low fees. But most HNers here are not begging for donations, or suffering from starvation or are currently at war (Ukraine) or not experiencing hyperinflation (Argentina) and are not the ones who experienced their bank accounts getting locked after p…

This kind of 'you only care if it affects you' argument is so disingenuous it makes my eyes bleed. You only care about crypto because you invested in it. Please tell me how much volunteer work you have put in for food relief or refugee causes then tell me how much money you have put into crypto and then let's see if you can claim the moral high ground.

> This kind of 'you only care if it affects you' argument is so disingenuous it makes my eyes bleed.

No it isn't as it is true on this site and the truth hurts and bleeds your eyes doesn't it? Obviously people like you can't stand it due to your highly emotional reaction.

> You only care about crypto because you invested in it.

Please.

Speculating on a stablecoin which the Stellar and Moneygram use case is for sending stable currencies for worldwide payments cheaply and instantly is hardly useful as an 'investment'.

> Please tell me how much volunteer work you have put in for food relief or refugee causes then tell me how much money you have put into crypto and then let's see if you can claim the moral high ground.

I can tell that people like you complaining have about it here isn't a solution to helping the refugees such as the ones in Ukraine for example or any of the help they need or anything close to a solution, whilst others are providing a solution today. [0]

So this is indeed a great crypto use case that you yourself realise that it works.

[0] https://thefintechtimes.com/stellar-aid-assist-creates-new-r...

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