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Ancient Carthaginians did sacrifice their children (2014)

ox.ac.uk

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Re: Ancient Carthaginians did sacrifice their children (2014)

#241
post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If an infant is able to survive outside of another person without being hooked up to modern medical equipment I would say there is a very big difference between it an something which cannot. What happens when we invent artificial wombs? It isn't that far away.

Awesome, you should get on that.

I'm saying the morality shouldn't depend on the convenience of technological limitations. A hundred years ago a six month fetus wasn't viable. Now they are. Would abortion still be moral if we could instantly and painlessly teleport a fetus into an artificial womb?

Re: Ancient Carthaginians did sacrifice their children (2014)

#243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Typically the gods did not look favorably on inferior product being placed on the alter. I bet "the gods" were especially apt to take that attitude in the cultures where people ate the sacrifice afterwards.

“Strictly speaking, you see, it’s prayers that go up to the gods,” said the priest doubtfully. “As I understand it,” said Moist, “the gift of sausages are offered to Offler by being fried, yes? And the spirit of the sausages ascends unto Offler by means of the smell? And then you eat the sausages?” “Ah, no. Not exactly. Not at all,” said the young priest, who knew this one. “It might look like that to the uninitiated…

Some may discern the taint of dualism in this (very amusing) dialogue.

https://radhesiam.com/bhagavadgita-quotes/bhagavad-gita-9-24...

There is this possibility to consider. Another Muslim Saint, Junaid (R), said “Water takes the color of the cup it is poured in”. The Prophet (SAWS) said “There is no I but Allah”.

You can always fashion a new cup to suit your contingent condition. But the spirit of Sacrifice, and the Enjoying of the pleasures is eternal and immutable. Is it possible that ritual sacrifice, however distorted by the understanding of ancient people, is an intrinsic impetus of the conscious knowing, feeling, desiring (and at times afflicted) being known as Human, guiding us to detachment so that we may too enjoy without attachment, like God.

Re: Ancient Carthaginians did sacrifice their children (2014)

#244
post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If an infant is able to survive outside of another person without being hooked up to modern medical equipment I would say there is a very big difference between it an something which cannot.

If an infant is able to survive outside of another person without being hooked up to modern medical equipment I would say there is a very big difference between it an something which cannot. What happens when we invent artificial wombs? It isn't that far away.

or men having children, which would both be a highly desirable option for society as well as completely knocking the (specious) women's rights/controlling (specifically female) bodies argument out from the equation.

Re: Ancient Carthaginians did sacrifice their children (2014)

#245
post #59

I remember reading an analysis of a script written during the wars of Carthage with Rome which had this incredible meaning: "Stop adopting slave children to sacrifice them so that we have a favorable outcome, it needs to be your actual children". Most if not all Mediterranean civilizations practiced child sacrifice, for Minoans the keywords for those with access to scientific papers is "The Southern House of Knossos"…

Given the paucity of Punic texts that we possess, I'd be surprised to learn that this script of which you speak is in any language other than Latin.

Most, if not all civilizations, practice child sacrifice to this day. It's called war, and it's practiced to such a ritualistic, feverish pitch that it may as well be a public festival glorifying death and national identity.

The "proof" that the Carthaginians, Canaanites, and Bronze Age Minoans practiced child sacrifice begs a misanthropic perspective from the start. While our modern society may think nothing of animals, and even reject the notion that they possess a soul, this was certainly not the case for the Etruscans or Canaanites. We have ample evidence, in the case of Etruria, that children who died prematurely were embalmed and buried with the remains of household pets, in the hope that the souls of both the animals and the children would be enticed to reincarnate in the presence of their living loved ones again. Being as close to residential districts as they were, these Carthaginian "tophets" served the same purpose--directing the souls of those who perished to return in new forms. The concept that these children were murdered to appease barbarous, foreign gods exposes a level of ignorance and anti-Semiticism that is unfortunately altogether too familiar in the modern-day.

As for the "Southern House of Knossos", the keyword here is "excarnation" and is an alternative method of mummification.

Re: Ancient Carthaginians did sacrifice their children (2014)

#246

Great timing on empires who sacrifice children. Today this article about Instagram facilitating child sex trafficking was released. https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/instagram-facilitates-vast... Mel Gibson is about to release a four part documentary about child sex trafficking and sacrifice. I expect to see a bunch of reminders of how Mel is antisemitic and such to gatekeep people from watching it.

something something groomers?

Re: Ancient Carthaginians did sacrifice their children (2014)

#247
post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Awesome, you should get on that.

I'm saying the morality shouldn't depend on the convenience of technological limitations. A hundred years ago a six month fetus wasn't viable. Now they are. Would abortion still be moral if we could instantly and painlessly teleport a fetus into an artificial womb?

Who cares? The question is 'what is the difference' and I gave one. Continue your crusade somewhere else.

Re: Ancient Carthaginians did sacrifice their children (2014)

#248
post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You would be surprised: a child that was difficult to provide for and had no future of providing for you in your old age wasn't that hard to discard even 100 years ago.

Some people believe abortion is basically the same thing

[flagged]

Re: Ancient Carthaginians did sacrifice their children (2014)

#249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn’t pass the smell test. Many ancient cultures also ritually sacrificed warriors and nobility.

Any references, or we are supposed to go off your word? René Girard gives plenty in the book. He also notes that sacrifice of an outcast is a thing, I think I mentioned it already: once a person is stripped of his or her membership in society, that person becomes a perfectly valid sacrificial scapegoat—no matter whether that person used to be a warrior or a noble. Note also that, while we are talking about ritual sac…

Most classical histories include some ethnographic descriptions of foreign rituals. Check out Herodotus, Thucydides, Livy, etc.

For a modern and extensive compilation, Frazer famously wrote a huge multi-volume work that documents sacrificial myths from all over the world in The Golden Bough. He selects and uses them to make his own argument, but you’re not likely to find a more comprehensive compilation.

Re: Ancient Carthaginians did sacrifice their children (2014)

#250

Great timing on empires who sacrifice children. Today this article about Instagram facilitating child sex trafficking was released. https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/instagram-facilitates-vast... Mel Gibson is about to release a four part documentary about child sex trafficking and sacrifice. I expect to see a bunch of reminders of how Mel is antisemitic and such to gatekeep people from watching it.

That part about Gibson doing a documentary is not true. Just Google it.
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