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Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

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Re: Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

#991

Post by TabithaES »

dendriti wrote: post #815
dimgl wrote: post #608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's truly depressing. Reddit's usefulness as an aggregator is what's kept me around for so long. But the sheer extremist views I see on a daily basis are so off-putting. My wife jokes about how I say every other month that "I'm going to quit Reddit". It's so weird to me that they've let the mods go absolutely bonkers. I've gotten banned from so many subreddits simply for having a different opinion.

Nearly every time a user whines about being banned from a subreddit by evil mods for "muh different opinion", they were just being assholes.

> asshole mods, asshole users

Both scenarios too common to judge.

Re: Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

#992

Post by 58x14 »

eru wrote: post #731
58x14 wrote: post #99

I think it's very clear that the recent LLM boom is directly responsible for Twitter, Reddit, and others quickly moving to restricted APIs with exorbitant pricing structures. I don't think these orgs really care much about third-party clients other than a nuisance consuming some fraction of their userbase. Enterprise deals between these user generated content platforms and LLM platforms may well involve many billions…

If you want training data for an LLM and are actively talking to some data providers, you'd just ask for a dump, instead of making a billion small requests. (You'd make the billion small requests, if you are doing this on the sly.)

You’re right, but I think it’s also pretty clear that

A) there is demand for functionality that depends on semi-real-time data, e.g. a prompt like “explain {recent_trending_topic} to me and describe its evolution” where the return could be useful in various contexts;

B) the degradation of search experience and the explosion of chat interfaces seem to indicate “the future of search is chat” and the number of Google searches prefixed or suffixed with “Reddit” make it obvious that LLM-powered chat models with search functionality will want to query Reddit extensively, and in the example prompt above, the tree of queries generated to fulfill a single prompt could be sizeable;

C) improvements to fine-tuning pipelines make it more and more feasible to use real-time data in the context of LLMs, such as a “trending summary” function that could cache many potentially related queries from Reddit, Twitter, etc and use them to fine-tune a model which would serve a response to my example prompt

Re: Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

#993

Post by MagicMoonlight »

donmcronald wrote: post #382
yojo wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook's average revenue per user (ARPU) is ~$10/quarter[0], and 6x that in the US. Which is honestly kind of stunning. Reddit is presumably much less than that, but they might be reasonably gunning for a number better than Pinterest, with an ARPU of ~$1.50[1]. To put the pricing post into the same context, we're talking $7.50 per Apollo user/quarter, which is closer to what Facebook makes per user than Pinterest.…

> Facebook's average revenue per user (ARPU) is ~$10/quarter[0], and 6x that in the US. Can someone explain this to me? Why is it so high? Even if every single person on Facebook buys a product because of ads once per year, doesn't that mean companies are paying $240 to acquire a customer in the US? Is it worth that? My first though was that maybe 1% of users buy something in a given year, but that's $24k to acquire…

The most successful marketing campaign of all time is the marketing team convincing everyone that marketing works.

Of course the money is all being spaffed for nothing. It doesn’t take a degree in applied ecosystem analysis from Aberyswyth Technical College to figure out that Coke spending 50m on a christmas campaign doesn’t sell anymore Coke.

Re: Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

#994

Post by 9935c101ab17a66 »

wilsonnb3 wrote: post #502
superfrank wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One can only hope there'll be a watershed moment like the one that killed Digg. I think a critical part of the Digg exodus was that most people already saw Reddit as a clear #2 in the space. When Digg fucked up, there was an obvious place for everyone to migrate to. I don't see that right now. Facebook isn't cool anymore, Twitter has a large number of people who won't use it because of Elon, Mastodon isn't mature e…

Discord seems the most likely, it matches the subreddit model and a lot of Reddit communities already have a discord. Obviously Discord is chat focused so not a one-to-one replacement but I am not sure that the younger generations will care. Plus there is the possibility of discord adding a Reddit/forum like feature, since they already have the mindshare.

Absolutely not. Discords UX is a hot mess for its intended use case, absolutely no way it is good enough to flex to being a Reddit.

Re: Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

#995

Post by albertopv »

lofaszvanitt wrote: post #276
albertopv wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I spend 5€/month for my mobile phone plan, 40GB data cap. 5€/month for a service extending reddit is quite a lot

Where in the hell you live where that generous mobile plan exists?

Italy. WindTre plan.

Re: Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

#996

Post by eru »

fennecfoxy wrote: post #953
eru wrote: post #731

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want training data for an LLM and are actively talking to some data providers, you'd just ask for a dump, instead of making a billion small requests. (You'd make the billion small requests, if you are doing this on the sly.)

Eh can still just automate creating a bunch of accounts and do it manually. Use one of the many captcha completion services where you pay for people to complete captchas for you. ML models can already pretty much do them anyway. Then rotate between accounts and put a random time between requests. Restrict certain accounts to browse within certain hours/timezones. Load pages as usual and just scrape data from the page…

> Just like Tumblr, Reddit seem intent on killing themselves, although these days I'm not so sure. When Elon took over Twitter everyone was saying that all the users would leave and it would die. This is not the case, human nature means that people seek familiarity and will cling on, hmm.

Wouldn't network effects be the obvious null hypothesis, before we start speculating about human nature?

Re: Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

#997

Post by wesapien »

armchairhacker wrote: post #585
gaudat wrote: post #480

I have a story to tell, about the demise of one of the largest internet forums in my language. About ten years ago, when smartphones just started appearing, the forum did not have a mobile version, and there are various 3rd party clients on the App Store or Android Market. Later on, one of the largest 3rd party client was blocked, because of they hammering the forum's servers too hard,. Or something about caching and…

This is such a good idea even without Reddit's monetization and potentially blocking NSFW content. To me it seems obvious. It's also something that's actually likely to succeed and within the community's control, unlike getting Reddit to change their stance. Like, there's nothing stopping this from developing right now. - "There won't be as many people." That's ok, probably even a good thing. 1.5-2.5 million users ar…

4chan is indeed not the ideal but the current reddit isn't ideal either because it leans too much progressive. i would like to prune both extremes.

Re: Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

#998

Post by wesapien »

gaudat wrote: post #653
Devasta wrote: post #643

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tech isn't the challenge with something like Reddit, even the comically inept Reddit leadership could figure it out after all. The difficult part is finding a few hundred mods willing to work for you for free, filtering all the filth that tries to be posted. Only if they have a solution for that can try going their own way.

What happened with reddit is imo the mods affect the site's direction moreso than the administration or the devs. This is what happens when you put profit and cancerous growth above cultivating a community.

this is what happens when you let the patients manage the hospital. similar to what's happening in politics. the left and right extremists dictate the narratives. i can only dream when moderates gain some balls and put each extremes into their place. the moderates should be cultivating the culture.

Re: Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

#999

Post by johnnyanmac »

armchairhacker wrote: post #585
gaudat wrote: post #480

I have a story to tell, about the demise of one of the largest internet forums in my language. About ten years ago, when smartphones just started appearing, the forum did not have a mobile version, and there are various 3rd party clients on the App Store or Android Market. Later on, one of the largest 3rd party client was blocked, because of they hammering the forum's servers too hard,. Or something about caching and…

This is such a good idea even without Reddit's monetization and potentially blocking NSFW content. To me it seems obvious. It's also something that's actually likely to succeed and within the community's control, unlike getting Reddit to change their stance. Like, there's nothing stopping this from developing right now. - "There won't be as many people." That's ok, probably even a good thing. 1.5-2.5 million users ar…

>We're going to need those moderators to prevent the Apollo social network from becoming the next 4chan (because, hopefully you understand, that's a bad thing)

TBH, 4chan these days are nowhere near the days when it was known as the boogieman of the internet. Still stuck with language that wouldn't last 10 seconds on Twitter or even Reddit, but we're not talking about a doxxing/harassment hub anymore. Or at least, no more a hub for that than Twitter/Reddit.

Re: Had a call with Reddit to discuss pricing

#1000

Post by johnnyanmac »

rat9988 wrote: post #885
armchairhacker wrote: post #585

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is such a good idea even without Reddit's monetization and potentially blocking NSFW content. To me it seems obvious. It's also something that's actually likely to succeed and within the community's control, unlike getting Reddit to change their stance. Like, there's nothing stopping this from developing right now. - "There won't be as many people." That's ok, probably even a good thing. 1.5-2.5 million users ar…

> I believe HN has around 1.5-2.5 million and the content here is way better than Reddit. I have to heavily disagree with this. Reddit content is way better in both quality and quantity. The only thing worse is maybe the Signal to noise ratio, and even that is questionable. For example, askHistorians is a gem. Many subreddits are very useful. Moreover, for many questions, I find myself adding "reddit" on google. Not…

>for many questions, I find myself adding "reddit" on google.

I do it more out of necessity than because reddit is a good site. You get into a niche enough subject and your choice is either a small subreddit or delving into the artifacts of the early internet like GameFaqs, Deviant Art, or some new site forums (the ones that still exist). I Still need to take a grain of salt and check if the redditor isn't blowing hot air or isn't on some unhinged rant.

HN is great but focused on very specific, technical contetnt. Not gonna be much oppurtunity to talk about media or craft hobbies here.

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