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Plane: Open-Source Alternative to Jira

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Re: Plane: Open-Source Alternative to Jira

#211

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

mark_and_sweep wrote: post #161
bipson wrote: post #155

The Problem with Jira is not that it's dumb or too sophisticated. The first problem is that everyone, even in the same team or org, needs something different from it. Sometimes it is even single individuals needing one particular thing one time, and the same day for another workflow or view another thing. It is when Jira caters to the wrong use case for you right now where the a lot of frustration arises. In a simila…

The biggest issue, in my experience, has always been its performance. Perhaps I have only worked in organisations that have completely misconfigured their Jira instances or the servers are underpowered, but even with the Atlassian Cloud, I am used to waiting 10 seconds to move a ticket from one column to another. Or add a ticket to the backlog, click the backlog, ticket isn't there yet, refresh the backlog, it's ther…

> Perhaps I have only worked in organisations that have completely misconfigured their Jira instances or the servers are underpowered, but even with the Atlassian Cloud, I am used to waiting 10 seconds to move a ticket from one column to another.

There must be some sort of misconfiguration going on here, as I never have this experience in Jira Cloud. Your opinion is a common one so I'm not discounting it, but with "New Jira" as I call it (the Team-based projects), this never happens to me.

But in general, I agree that Atlassian should primarily focus on performance fixes, it is by far the most common complaint.

Re: Plane: Open-Source Alternative to Jira

#212

Post by notatoad »

pigeons wrote: post #99
notatoad wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jira sucks in the same way that email sucks - the platform is fine, the stuff people put in it sucks. you probably don't hate jira, you hate your boss, or their boss, or your colleagues, or your business's development practices or prioritization. or your developer's productivity levels, if you're looking at it from the management side. but it's easier (and probably healthier) for jira to soak up that hatred. jira's g…

even a default jira is unusable just from a slowness perspective.

i'm not really sure what your metric is here, or if you're talking about their on-prem version. but the jira hosted by atlassian seems like it runs at about the same speed as most websites. i'm not going to say it's blazing fast, but it's acceptable.

Re: Plane: Open-Source Alternative to Jira

#213

Post by kjs3 »

throwuwu wrote: post #35

Walk through video please. For people on mobile checking it out it’s more convenient to watch a short video. Serious about short, I’m not going to start a half hour long video while browsing. Also subtitles.

And a pony. They must provide a complimentary pony. An Andalusian...I wouldn't be caught dead on some common draft horse. Also a stable.

Re: Plane: Open-Source Alternative to Jira

#214

Post by vxNsr »

_ea1k wrote: post #210
vxNsr wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm sure it was super painful for the people who had to actually set up the current flows, but I guess that once you customise JIRA to your needs, it can work really well. The issue probably is that many companies don't want to bother setting up good, streamlined processes, or just don't know how. It’s actually not as bad as you’d think to set up. The reason Jira is so universally hated is because everyone uses it…

I don't know, I've seen that extreme, but I've also seen the other extreme. People with vast knowledge of JIRA, obviously far more than anyone else in the org, developing vast dashboards and labeling systems. Every ticket has to be properly groomed and properly built (even if not useful). That isn't always better.

Knowledge doesn’t equal expertise.

JIRA has a very simple initial onboarding story, especially in comparison to servicenow or SAP. But it’s got a lot of hidden complexity that can make it super powerful. That power can become its downfall if implemented badly. Vast dashboards and labeling systems is improper implementation.

Re: Plane: Open-Source Alternative to Jira

#215

Post by vxNsr »

ian-g wrote: post #135
vxNsr wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm sure it was super painful for the people who had to actually set up the current flows, but I guess that once you customise JIRA to your needs, it can work really well. The issue probably is that many companies don't want to bother setting up good, streamlined processes, or just don't know how. It’s actually not as bad as you’d think to set up. The reason Jira is so universally hated is because everyone uses it…

And then you have some poor suckers doing their damnedest to balance all the demands of all the middle managers who all want servicenow customizations on priority. Truly just a horrifying situation to be subjected to.

I fight a lot about unnecessary customization, but the one place that I’ll never back down on is touching the priority/urgency matrix.

Re: Plane: Open-Source Alternative to Jira

#216

Post by pigeons »

notatoad wrote: post #212
pigeons wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

even a default jira is unusable just from a slowness perspective.

i'm not really sure what your metric is here, or if you're talking about their on-prem version. but the jira hosted by atlassian seems like it runs at about the same speed as most websites. i'm not going to say it's blazing fast, but it's acceptable.

I mean I can't even use the one they host because I wait for things to load and spin.

Re: Plane: Open-Source Alternative to Jira

#217

Post by dventimihasura »

edude03 wrote: post #208
zelphirkalt wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Catering to many different kinds of people explains some of the bad stuff, but it does not explain, why seemingly every single Atlassian product including Jira sucks at parsing Markdown or supporting Markdown well. In the big picture maybe some things suffer from catering to too many audiences, but in the small, it is just lack of good engineering. Basically any markdown parser you can install at no cost and even wit…

It does explain it though? Not everyone who uses Atlassian products use markdown, and I'm pretty confident that the biggest users of Jira aren't software engineers so why would they invest time and effort there?

I wonder where you get your confidence. In my experience as a software engineer in the Bay Area for 25 years, every company I've worked at (all medium to large either ISVs or internet companies) used Jira and at every one of those companies Jira was used most heavily by software engineers.

Re: Plane: Open-Source Alternative to Jira

#218

Post by rirze »

MobiusHorizons wrote: post #94

From a brief look at the code, it appears to be written in python. I am surprised at that choice for an application that has speed as a goal. Of course database performance is likely to dominate, but every bit adds up. I feel like I’ve only heard bad things about trying to maintain a service written in python long term (both from a performance perspective, as well as ease of code maintenance). This is not first hand…

From what I can tell, it's Python for the API server, Typescript for everything else.

FWIW, Python servers like this are just a wrapper around `gunicorn` or some other performant low level tool. For some teams, it's easier to define a schema in Python for a couple years now due to some very innovative libraries with easy-to-use decorators.

I have no personal experience with using it in production or for an extended amount of time however.

Re: Plane: Open-Source Alternative to Jira

#220

Post by 3riverdev »

kschrader wrote: post #205

Having spent 7 years now building https://www.shortcut.com/ it's very clear to me that at a certain point in the life-cycle of many organizations a bunch of people get hired who can only "think in Jira" and the vast majority of feature requests are attempts to get us to add whatever feature(s) they love using. Conversations about why it's bad for developers or product managers or attempts to show them how to get the…

For what it's worth, thank you for fighting this fight. Shortcut has been a fantastic tool for us as a direct result of it doing things differently and more naturally. Please don't change that!
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