Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Europe data salary benchmark 2023

medium.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 83 posts

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#41

Post by mahmoudhossam »

cscurmudgeon wrote: post #38
mahmoudhossam wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As in healthcare is very expensive over there and that most of it is tied to the employer. I'm not sure what you're asking here.

It is expensive but salaries are also higher. Most people pay a few hundred at max per month on several thousand dollars of salary. I am not sure what you mean by saying "constitutes the bulk of benefits in the US" https://www.statista.com/statistics/631987/percent-of-income... Do you mean outside of plain salary, medical benefits are the highest? I think that may be more correct. But even that may not be universally…

Yes, I'm not counting the salary as a benefit.

I'm not really familiar with US pension plans so I stand corrected.

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#42

Post by tough »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #37
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the states, we'd be getting paid less if the companies should get away with it. And in the states, we definitely don't collectively bargain. So something else is the issue.

Yes, there are hardly any European companies with FAANG level profitability. Thats it.

VC Money is US mostly too

Europe-founded startups end up in delaware because of ycombinator and all the SF money that does have an apetite for high risk startups unlike europe.

Here we waste billions on shady govt mandated stuff and thats' it

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#43

Post by joshvm »

thomasingalls wrote: post #24

Why isn't France ever in these datasets?

Also Switzerland (or Scandinavia for that matter) which pays similar to the US for tech jobs. Even academic jobs here pay exceptionally well compared to anywhere else in Europe. Starting salary for a good data scientist role (requiring some domain expertise) here is close to 100k CHF (not including Big Tech who can easily pay 1.5x more). Cost of living is high, but frankly London is comparable in terms of rent nowadays if you consider like-for-like (i.e. centre of the city, short commute).

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#44

Post by thefourthchime »

emptysongglass wrote: post #35
woobar wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. You like your social safety net? You like stronger worker protection? Long vacations? Someone has to pay for all of it. Either through higher taxes or lower wages.

I have to take out salary insurance because welfare benefits wouldn't even begin to cover living expenses. You have such a thing in the US too. In Denmark, it's easy to fire and easy to hire (let at hyre og fyre [1]) so what am I liking here? At US Google I understand it's 30 days paid time off a calendar year: that's the same standard as Europe. Yet Google will happily pay the same role less than half when hired her…

I don't have an answer for this, but I know that in Poland, there are numerous engineering offices located outside of Warsaw. Engineers in these offices are paid well compared to the average Polish salary. These variations in compensation are influenced by market forces.

While engineers may be more affordable in Europe, there are trade-offs to consider. One such trade-off is the significant time zone difference between California and Europe, making synchronization challenging. Additionally, cultural synchronization can be difficult, and there is significant value in having teams that share the same figurative and literal language.

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#45

Post by 88913527 »

woobar wrote: post #33
emptysongglass wrote: post #28

We are getting absolutely fleeced by our American counterparts and paying higher taxes on top. Yet we're every bit as good developers, DevOps Engineers, SREs, you name it in tech. And cost of living in US metro areas vs Europe does not even begin to explain why. I wish we'd collectively take a harder stance on the bargaining line because it is insane to me we be paid half, a third less and then shell out very high ta…

You can't have your cake and eat it too. You like your social safety net? You like stronger worker protection? Long vacations? Someone has to pay for all of it. Either through higher taxes or lower wages.

You could take away Europe's social safety net and wages would still be lower. There is no equivalent to Silicon Valley there which creates the competition that bids up salaries.

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#46

Post by majikaja »

emptysongglass wrote: post #28

We are getting absolutely fleeced by our American counterparts and paying higher taxes on top. Yet we're every bit as good developers, DevOps Engineers, SREs, you name it in tech. And cost of living in US metro areas vs Europe does not even begin to explain why. I wish we'd collectively take a harder stance on the bargaining line because it is insane to me we be paid half, a third less and then shell out very high ta…

Why not just change career?

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#47

Post by adam_arthur »

emptysongglass wrote: post #28

We are getting absolutely fleeced by our American counterparts and paying higher taxes on top. Yet we're every bit as good developers, DevOps Engineers, SREs, you name it in tech. And cost of living in US metro areas vs Europe does not even begin to explain why. I wish we'd collectively take a harder stance on the bargaining line because it is insane to me we be paid half, a third less and then shell out very high ta…

Pay always comes down to supply and demand of labor, not value added.

If you have a button that earns $1m a press, its a pretty valuable role to press it, but you can also hire literally anyone to do it. So pay for pressing the button can be quite low despite large value creation. Now, if only one person is eligible to press the button, he can easily negotiate up to $1m a press for himself. Same work, lower supply of labor.

For a long time, in person work and demand for people in SF Bay area led to major wage inflation in US tech jobs. I was there through the 2010s and saw firsthand what seemed to be 15-20% wage inflation YoY for many years.

With remote work that future is looking more tenuous. There are lower cultural barriers to having teams collocated in different timezones now that most people are remote in general.

So wages are likely to normalize somewhat over time… likely flatish in nominal terms for US workers, but down in real terms until other locales catch up. There’s still going to be a preference to hire US workers in a remote world, but the effect is going to weaken a lot.

Such high pay in real terms for people with minimal YoE is going to be considered an aberration in retrospect

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#50

Post by moralestapia »

itcrowd wrote: post #3

There's a huge difference in CoL between the mentioned metro areas. Pretty useless comparison in that regard.

>Pretty useless comparison in that regard.

???

"Europe data salary benchmark 2023", what made you think you'd find cost of living statistics there?

Post reply on HN