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Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

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Re: Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

#141

Post by m4jor »

amoshi wrote: post #44

>Intelligence professionals talk about how disorienting it is living on the inside. You read so much classified information about the world’s geopolitical events that you start seeing the world differently. You become convinced that only the insiders know what’s really going on, because the news media is so often wrong. Your family is ignorant. Your friends are ignorant. The world is ignorant. The only thing keeping…

>Don't want to agree? You end up like Qwest (CEO got jailed) or Yahoo ($250k daily fine until they comply). The power gained is immense though, just read about XKeyScore.

also the Lavabit owner, Ladar Levison, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavabit

Re: Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

#142

Post by solrik »

hashworks wrote: post #137
MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's important to remember that they invaded Ukraine for no reason This is not true. Real people have motives, „being evil“ is a child's explanation for things it doesn’t understand.

You can categorize some motives as evil, but the definition of evil is quite relative. You could extend it to "disturbing the peace", which Russia clearly did.

Big fact is that is was not unprovoked. The war started in 2014 when the US forced Ukraine to pick a side. The best thing for Ukrainians would be neutrality. But the US did not allow that.

Re: Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

#143

Post by Loquebantur »

FormerBandmate wrote: post #122
theaussiestew wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basically anyone who sits at a panel, interview or a discussion and talks about geopolitical affairs. It’s the space around politics and think tanks and national security. There’s an implicit expectation that you talk about certain topics in a certain way, and that way usually conforms to the narrative that’s acceptable to the apparatus of power. It’s a vague description but that’s because of the nature of this unspo…

Russia commits countless war crimes on a daily basis (there is tons of documentation) and China has concentration camps. America is not perfect but they are legitimately much worse

The US has Guantanamo Bay. Among others.

The US did commit various war crimes in about every of their foreign engagements. Those had to be leaked of course and weren't reported by some self-correction built into the system.

The US uses false narratives like "national security" to justify unjustifiable actions regularly. See their economic sanctions, Huawei, etc. pp.

The list goes on of course. Now, the one thing clearly better about the US is, people being able to talk about it. But that only has meaning if it is done and actually leads to changes. Else it is only another layer of deception.

Re: Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

#144

Post by pydry »

pstuart wrote: post #103
lern_too_spel wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People still believe this to this day. Who? It is accepted that Trump got help from Russia and that he publicly asked for it. It is not accepted that he has strong ties with Russia, and unlike what the GGP has claimed, there is no "official" story saying that. The only person who did say that was private investigator Steele, in a dossier that Clinton didn't believe and discarded but that McCain did and leaked.

As I understand it, the Wikileaks DNC email dump was just a front for Russia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Democratic_National_Commi...

which is often accused, although never proven.

when putin accuses media he doesnt like of being foreign agents without proof we can recognize how transparently self serving it is. wouldnt you agree?

Re: Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

#145

Post by markus_zhang »

anonymousiam wrote: post #54
amoshi wrote: post #44

>Intelligence professionals talk about how disorienting it is living on the inside. You read so much classified information about the world’s geopolitical events that you start seeing the world differently. You become convinced that only the insiders know what’s really going on, because the news media is so often wrong. Your family is ignorant. Your friends are ignorant. The world is ignorant. The only thing keeping…

To take what you've said a little further, intelligence agencies have the "law" behind them, but once you become aware of everything they (all of them, worldwide) are doing, you get a completely different perspective on the "law" itself. Being involved in these activities can also diminish your ethical base, which I guess explains some of the crazy law-ignoring/law-breaking activities within all governments.

Law is a weapon of the ruling class.

That's why I laugh at whoever suggests about unions. Downvote me as you wish, but it won't fix the problem for ya.

Re: Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

#146

Post by poxrud »

smcl wrote: post #131
dralley wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I tolerate the spook-adjacent types in my field who parrot absurd official lines and slogans about russian interference because being seen to align with it is just how they are trying to survive I present to you a real, still-active Russian troll account. https://twitter.com/blackintheempir How do I know it's a troll account? Take a look at this: https://twitter.com/reshetz/status/1662112840554098688 Just like "Ther…

There's so many of them and they're so hyperbolic and wrong. Take good old @witte_sergei, claiming here during the huge gains Ukraine had last year that the "scale of Ukraine’s defeat at Lyman will become clear in the coming days": https://twitter.com/witte_sergei/status/1575975278652043264 Meanwhile Lyman remains under Ukrainian control: https://deepstatemap.live/en#11/48.9534/37.8129 That's just one of them, this g…

“Meanwhile Lyman remains under Kremlin control”

Lyman is under Ukrainian control

Re: Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

#147

Post by MrVandemar »

FormerBandmate wrote: post #121
theaussiestew wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very eloquently phrased. Some of the commonly accepted truths and geopolitics narratives are quite disturbing and actually very Orwellian in a genuine (and not clichéd) sense. Narratives around China and Russia, narratives around our own liberty are completed warped, and to speak out singles you out. There’s definitely a chilling effect about what is acceptable to talk about and what isn’t. See my other comment on th…

[flagged]

> It's important to remember that they invaded Ukraine for no reason,

That's extremely reductive. The situation is a bit more complex than that. I don't think they were right to invade -- not remotely -- I think it's abhorrent. But there is a little more historical context with the US and other regional tensions than Putin rolling a 1D6 and deciding that meant "hey, I'm bored, let's invade".

Re: Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

#148

Post by faddypaddy34 »

FormerBandmate wrote: post #122
theaussiestew wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basically anyone who sits at a panel, interview or a discussion and talks about geopolitical affairs. It’s the space around politics and think tanks and national security. There’s an implicit expectation that you talk about certain topics in a certain way, and that way usually conforms to the narrative that’s acceptable to the apparatus of power. It’s a vague description but that’s because of the nature of this unspo…

Russia commits countless war crimes on a daily basis (there is tons of documentation) and China has concentration camps. America is not perfect but they are legitimately much worse

The Ukraine used illegally cluster bombs on ethnic Russians for years. This is actually documentation. https://www.hrw.org/news/2014/10/20/ukraine-widespread-use-c...

Re: Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

#149

Post by smcl »

poxrud wrote: post #146
smcl wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's so many of them and they're so hyperbolic and wrong. Take good old @witte_sergei, claiming here during the huge gains Ukraine had last year that the "scale of Ukraine’s defeat at Lyman will become clear in the coming days": https://twitter.com/witte_sergei/status/1575975278652043264 Meanwhile Lyman remains under Ukrainian control: https://deepstatemap.live/en#11/48.9534/37.8129 That's just one of them, this g…

“Meanwhile Lyman remains under Kremlin control” Lyman is under Ukrainian control

I originally wrote something along the lines of "... is pretty far from under Kremlin control" and decided to simplify it before hitting send :) Oops, fixed now.

Re: Reflections on Ten Years Past the Snowden Revelations

#150

Post by mrcode007 »

Loquebantur wrote: post #143
FormerBandmate wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Russia commits countless war crimes on a daily basis (there is tons of documentation) and China has concentration camps. America is not perfect but they are legitimately much worse

The US has Guantanamo Bay. Among others. The US did commit various war crimes in about every of their foreign engagements. Those had to be leaked of course and weren't reported by some self-correction built into the system. The US uses false narratives like "national security" to justify unjustifiable actions regularly. See their economic sanctions, Huawei, etc. pp. The list goes on of course. Now, the one thing clea…

The huawei sanctions are a result of the origins of the company. Many people forget or never knew about the hacks that happened over 10 years ago

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/nortel-collapse-linked-to-c...

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2020-07-01/did-china...

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