211–220 of 351 posts
Quit your jobs, peeps, or unionize. Gotta put your money where your mouth is.
Why should anyone quit their job? The company is the one who changed the terms of employment. Mass walkouts are a form of collective action, and are a good step towards unionization. Amazon can fire all the participants if they want (but something tells me they are not going to).
How do the Amazon warehouse workers feel about that? I could guess, but I don't know for sure.
You’re looking at it in a backwards way. I want to work from home. And while I understand warehouse workers cannot wfh, I think they should get paid regular wage for their commute time. Don’t go back in time.
Do you trust all of the workers to accurately report when they left home?
How do you handle a person who carpools and has an extra 30 minutes of diversion for that carpool drop off route?
When I was in Eau Claire, one of my coworkers commuted from Minneapolis (for various reasons) - 1.5h each way. As we were not exempt workers (and I suspect that warehouse workers aren't exempt either) should he get time and a half for working 6h in a day? When we had a blizzard one day and he decided to not take a day off and ended up with a 5h trip in (and I suspect a at least 2h on the way back) should he be getting time and a half for that?
Can I get fired for moving further away from the place of employment even if I show up on time for work each day? This year my commute is 30 minutes each way, and then I move another 15m further away next year... and another 15m away the next year...
Alice and Bob are neighbors. Alice drives in (30 min commute) while Bob takes the bus (2h with transfers).
Those crazy SF2G people commute in on bike ( https://sf2g.com ). The half moon bay route is about 4.5h...
Charlie bikes to work in the summer (and drives in inclement weather). Biking to work is 2h while driving is 20 minutes. Does he get paid 2h if he shows up on a bike (and then needs to take a shower and change) vs only paid for 20 minutes if he drives? Could the employer mandate that he drives to work?
David drives through McDs each day for breakfast (adding 7 minutes to the commute in). Does he get paid for that additional (unnecessary) time? Today the drive through is broken so he stops, gets out, orders in and eats breakfast in (15 min). Does he get paid for the entire "left house" to "arrived at office"? Only in the car (+7 min drive through)? Or did it reset when he got out of the car at McDs?
Edward normally has a 20 minute commute. Today, his kids missed the school bus today and so he drove his kids 20 minutes in the other direction resulting in 1h total commute time. Does he get paid for 40 more minutes (turns out it pays better to drive the kids to school rather than the bus pass!)
Freddie normally drives in (it's a short commute - only 10 min), but today is a nice day and the shift doesn't start until later this afternoon and decides to walk to work instead (1.5h).
George lives up north and in the winter snowmobiles in to the warehouse rather than taking a car. It's another 15 min because he can't take the highway (and yes, I've seen snowmobile parking at a distribution center up north).
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I'm not going to say that it is wrong to compensate someone for commute time. I will say that compensating someone for commute time will create things that other people regard as profoundly unfair and may incentivize things that we would rather not have be the case.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I agree from a technological/logical standpoint but from a human/emotional standpoint I think there are issues. People love to complain/go to press about HR decisions. The press would love to portray Musk as hypocritical about treating production line workers as second class denizens. The headline writes itself. I tthink the way you overcome it is by paying a premium to in office staff. In your scenario - onsite nurs…
> from a human/emotional standpoint I think there are issues From an emotional standpoint, sure, but not from a moral standpoint, which is what your previous post was saying. There is no moral case for punishing an advantaged class if that punishment does nothing to help the other class.
That said I could for see cases where the laptop class could be isolated from pain when a separate class has to do the physical work. Imagine a scenario where the laptop class engineer does some sloppy work in order to pick up the kids for soccer. The goof up requires 100 production line people to redo step 8 of 30 steps for 3 additional hours.
That goof up will be less visible there - buried in the timesheets of 100 workers - than at a company that has outsourced production line work. At the outsourced production company the goof up will show up as the additional change order which will have a directly mappable line item on the quarterly accounting that the responsible engineer will need to answer for.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
My two cents on this is that he is saying "working from home is morally wrong" - for his companies ... but he left out the for his companies part. He owns a car company and a space ship company - both of which have assembly lines with tons of workers. A majority of his employees will need to be working in a factory or with physical equipment/prototypes. Therefore they must be at the office or at the plant. In that en…
Why stop here? Some workers have shifts, some have to work outside in the rain. It's only fair that everyone works outside in the rain in shifts?
There are people whose jobs involve abseiling from the side of a building.
Therefore it's only fair that we should all be doing our jobs while abseiling from the side of a building.
The amount of class warfare here is hilarious. Will you really parrot elite coined phrases like “laptop class?” What even is the laptop class? It’s a meaningless term created so it’s easier to dehumanize a group of people that have a massive salary range. There are WFH making $50k. They are not all vest and resters. Do we really need to make the conversation be about the upper middle class being “lazy” and completely…
The amount of class warfare here is hilarious. Will you really parrot elite coined phrases like “laptop class?” What even is the laptop class? It’s a meaningless term created so it’s easier to dehumanize a group of people that have a massive salary range. There are WFH making $50k. They are not all vest and resters. Do we really need to make the conversation be about the upper middle class being “lazy” and completely…
Sometimes, I think about the phrase "human resource" and how it's a nice linguistic nod toward "natural resources", which obviously are meant to be exploited. It makes it easier when you think about laying off thousands of people, or making thousands commute needlessly simply to boost someone's ego.
There was no traffic. Even in LA!
How does one not yearn for that. I don't get it.
Also screw the office, coworkers are so distracting. I don't know how anyone gets anything done. Any amount of chit-chat throws me off and gives me a headache.
I still think out of all the...unique... things Elon has said... work from home is morally wrong has to take the cake. I try to spend time looking at things as radically as I can. I think it's helpful to accept folks views as widely as possible, but I'm still trying to wrap my head around work from home being morally wrong. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5OHFt8QyiU I was on a bicycle ride listening to this intervie…
Pure speculation, but my guess is that he’s invested in the commercial real estate market and hoping for a turnaround. I don’t think it’s some profound or insane ideology he has, I think he’s just trying to prop up CRE like he does with crypto. He’s famous for buying distressed commercial properties and for gaslighting, it just makes sense and the whole moral argument was a great way to get people talking about it.
In his case, it could be solar lighting or else he is not about renewables as he claim to be :)
Earlier quoted context omitted.
He's hedging his bets by not paying rent for Twitter's offices.
Maybe someone can help me understand this. If I were to refuse to pay my rent. My landlord would post an eviction notice and if I refused to comply, I would likely be arrested or forcibly removed. Why can’t the landlord “evict” twitter? Does the process look significantly different for commercial real estate? Does twitter provide value to the landlord in some form other than rent? Maybe they’re afraid of bad PR?