Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns • Hacker News Board

Re: Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns

#181

Post by bart_spoon » Tue, May 23, 2023, 5:36 PM UTC

nineplay wrote: post #104

sghiassy wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting that you wouldn't classify TikTok as social media. How would you characterize it?

I suppose I'd call it a video sharing platform. "Social media", to me, has an implication of media that is shared within a social circle. Facebook is social media because the intention is to share information with friends and family. No one is posting on FB hoping to have it go viral and make a pile of cash off it. TikToc is content creators sharing their videos with the whole world.

> TikToc is content creators sharing their videos with the whole world.

Seems like a "social"ly focused way of producing/consuming a particular kind of "media".

In all seriousness, I think the defining characteristics of social media for me include:

- a social graph, I can follow other entities, and they can follow me - bottomless, user produced content and feeds - interactive commentary and messaging between users - promotion algorithms, where the endless content is filtered and promoted, potentially leading to something going "viral", including by those who aren't in my immediate social network - a focus on sharing content between users - some form of voting, liking, or reacting

I don't think something needs all of the above to be considered social media. Some things ride the line quite a bit: a Discord server, if small between friends, probably doesn't qualify and is closer to a group chat. A large Discord server with lots of users who don't know each other? Probably counts. HackerNews, and other message boards? You could make an argument either way, but in HN's case, I'd say it is social media.

Re: Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns

#182

Post by trillic » Tue, May 23, 2023, 5:36 PM UTC

dundercoder wrote: post #132

ChicagoBoy11 wrote: post #3

I work at a fancy private school and partially am have hosted numerous events for parents on kids and social media. We have been banging on this key for easily the past 8 years, with varying levels of emphasis. The response from parents has also been universally consistent: A lot of nodding, and, ultimately, very little action. There has always been a small but consistent group of parents who stand firmly on their de…

I've worked in tech for 20+ years and I have 4 young kids. We allow our teenager use of a locked down smartphone, with a clearly explained zero expectation of privacy. We don't allow any social media on the phone itself. YouTube and other sites can be used under supervision for agreed on lengths of time. Once or twice a week my wife or I will go through their text messages with them and ask questions about anything t…

As a young adult who was recently a teenager, I can't help but feel concerned about the potential dangers of having no expectation of privacy from our parents, especially when it comes to reading through our text messages.

While I understand the intention behind it, this practice can easily lead to conflicts and strained relationships.

Teenagers are at a stage in their lives where they are trying to establish their independence and develop a sense of self. By invading their privacy, parents risk undermining their trust and creating an atmosphere of constant surveillance. This not only hampers the natural process of growing up but also sends a message that their thoughts and personal space are not respected.

Re: Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns

#183

Post by Filligree » Tue, May 23, 2023, 5:39 PM UTC

Tade0 wrote: post #180

dundercoder wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've worked in tech for 20+ years and I have 4 young kids. We allow our teenager use of a locked down smartphone, with a clearly explained zero expectation of privacy. We don't allow any social media on the phone itself. YouTube and other sites can be used under supervision for agreed on lengths of time. Once or twice a week my wife or I will go through their text messages with them and ask questions about anything t…

Personally I wouldn't implement such a policy purely because it's against my values. People generally value their privacy. How are children supposed to learn the same if their's is not respected?

Do children learn the value of privacy by having it, or because theirs isn't respected?

In my experience, there's a lot of the second.

Re: Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns

#184

Post by youreincorrect » Tue, May 23, 2023, 5:39 PM UTC

pixl97 wrote: post #167

youreincorrect wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can deal with it. In middle school, I was called a faggot, relentlessly, for not owning a Jansport backpack . I am 100% serious. They'll find friends, I'm pretty sure of it.

And what about the ones that didn't? Otherwise you're just talking about survivorship bias.

I flatly refuse any argument that assumes buying your kid a smartphone and allowing them on social media will solve their problems of social isolation. If a child is socially isolated from their peers, that is sad, and I personally do not know how to help them. But I still don't buy the argument that FB, Insta, TikTok, etc. are the solution because, what, their peers are on them?

Also, if some of these kids are being bullied, social media can exacerbate the problem. I allude to this in another comment where I speculate that if my mother had bought me the backpack, I think these kids would have still bullied me over something similar.

Re: Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns

#185

Post by ajsnigrutin » Tue, May 23, 2023, 5:39 PM UTC

zackmorris wrote: post #173

D.A.R.E. to Keep Kids Off Social Media Wages stagnated since 1980. Rents doubling every decade. Dead-end service jobs. Unpayable student loans. Social Security payments going to IOUs instead of retirements. Lying politicians and chief corporate officers making bank on the backs of the working poor. 30% credit card interest. Delaying childbirth to make rent until it's too late. GMO and processed foods poisoning giving…

Yep, this is how you get violent revolutions... people look at the average rent and an average paycheck/pension, realize they literally have nothing left to lose, and once they realize who's to blame, things (sometimes literally) explode.

Luckily (/s) we have social media to shift blame off of politicians to other groups of people, to fight eachother instead of the ones who profit from all this.

Re: Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns

#186

Post by CrampusDestrus » Tue, May 23, 2023, 5:40 PM UTC

knaik94 wrote: post #149

wonderwonder wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Respectfully, do you have kids and if so how old are they? At what age did you give them social media? Social media is absolutely just a communication platform but it allows anyone to communicate their biases and view points to your kids. It's very much not important. Kids can grow up to be well rounded and happy people without it.

I am giving you perspective from someone that had social media limited. Not having a social media presence caused other kids to leave me out of things. I missed a lot of context on drama that happened online, and was always late in learning about things. I don't have kids but I have been tutoring kids for the last 14 years, since I was basically a kid. I do individual tutoring for mostly high school, and occasionally…

>Not having a social media presence caused other kids to leave me out of things. I missed a lot of context on drama that happened online, and was always late in learning about things.

and?

Re: Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns

#187

Post by yumraj » Tue, May 23, 2023, 5:41 PM UTC

iamacyborg wrote: post #156

dundercoder wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've worked in tech for 20+ years and I have 4 young kids. We allow our teenager use of a locked down smartphone, with a clearly explained zero expectation of privacy. We don't allow any social media on the phone itself. YouTube and other sites can be used under supervision for agreed on lengths of time. Once or twice a week my wife or I will go through their text messages with them and ask questions about anything t…

I can understand being this careful with young children's usage of a device but giving teenagers zero privacy (to the extent of going through their personal messages) seems wild to me.

> but giving teenagers zero privacy (to the extent of going through their personal messages) seems wild to me.

Why? Teenagers are kids too, or have we forgotten that? They are actually worse than kids in some respect, still immature but with changing body and new hormones.

It may seem weird to them at this time, but hopefully they’ll appreciate when they grow older - or even if not, at least one did what they could.

Re: Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns

#188

Post by knaik94 » Tue, May 23, 2023, 5:43 PM UTC

wonderwonder wrote: post #166

knaik94 wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am giving you perspective from someone that had social media limited. Not having a social media presence caused other kids to leave me out of things. I missed a lot of context on drama that happened online, and was always late in learning about things. I don't have kids but I have been tutoring kids for the last 14 years, since I was basically a kid. I do individual tutoring for mostly high school, and occasionally…

That's the thing, social media is full of people like Tate pushing all sorts of views. All the things you missed out on with social media that you rightly describe as drama were not important. I don't even have that much of an issue with Tate, he's just obviously trying to get people to pay for his membership. Some of the ideas he pushes are far less dangerous than the other stuff being pushed out there. I do disagre…

Their parents trust me to talk to their kids about things they didn't feel comfortable about. Their parents ask me to look out for their kids and implicitly understand that I'm told things that they aren't. I think it's a cultural difference in the role of education between Asian cultures and others. I was even occasionally asked by parents to take a bigger role than I was sometimes comfortable with, for certain things. I was not undermining the parent's roles. I understand your reservations, but they're misguided at best. The parents were who encouraged their kids to call me big brother and have shared their appreciation to me privately.

Re: Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns

#189

Post by pwpw » Tue, May 23, 2023, 5:44 PM UTC

bart_spoon wrote: post #128

Aromasin wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last 20 years haven't just seen an increase in social media usage though; it's seen a decrease in socializing between kids outside of school. It's easy to remove access to their socials. It's very hard to replace that with a function social life outside of school. That's a recipe for resentment and rebellion. That's not going to happen without input at a every level of society to bring back that mall/skate rink/p…

> it's seen a decrease in socializing between kids outside of school Because of social media. Sports teams and after school clubs didn't go anywhere. Parks didn't go anywhere. Malls are in decline but the period of time they were an active social location was the 80s and 90s, which is a blip in the grand scheme of things. Community centers still exist, churches still exist, libraries still exist, basements and backya…

> Malls are in decline but the period of time they were an active social location was the 80s and 90s, which is a blip in the grand scheme of things.

The ancient Greeks went to the marketplace (το αγορά) as a social location. That’s where agoraphobia, the fear of public spaces, stems from.

Re: Social media can be a ‘profound risk’ to youth, surgeon general warns

#190

Post by yumraj » Tue, May 23, 2023, 5:45 PM UTC

swader999 wrote: post #21

youreincorrect wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't give your kid a smartphone or laptop without only whitelisting certain sites. If they somehow get a device without permission, it gets donated.

Isolating them from their peers can be just as mentally devastating. I don't think there is a good solution to this.

Purely for argument sake: would the above apply if peer kids were in gang, or into drugs or alcohol or whatever?

Social media is no different from those, IMHO of course.