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The American Dream convinces people loneliness is normal

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Re: The American Dream convinces people loneliness is normal

#111

I spend so much of my time intentionally trying to cultivate community. In some respects, it is the over-arching theme of my adult life. I find community is very hard to come by so if I have to be the one to make it, so be it. I pay a pretty penny to be a member of a coworking space so I don't spend my workday alone. Three times per week I go to regularly-scheduled events (a game night, running club, and roller-skati…

Greatest decision I ever made was getting a remote gig, leaving the big city, and moving to a small town. There is enough going on here to keep busy, and everyone knows eachother. Would never dream of raising my kids somewhere like SF. If you want community, go somewhere it's valued. Everyone in the big city is a transient, only there to make money and find love before it's time to head for the suburbs.

Counterpoint: grew up in a small town and now have kids in SF. Moved to the small town before kindergarten and always felt like an outsider there - other kids knew each other because their parents went to school together and my parents invested 0 in socializing me when I was little.

In SF, if you seek it there is a strong parent community that feels like the other side of the fence to me - welcoming and inclusive. Everyone has different styles of parenting but we converge on keeping kids safe and supporting their play. The groups are far more diverse ethnically, economically and even politically here and I think that is healthy exposure for kids.

Yes, a few families move out each year but my son has a group of kids he has hung out with since he was 3 (8 now). The kids all go to different schools but as I have learned from people who grew up in SF, kids tend to make cross school connections and friendships pollinate across schools so high school parties can turn into big group hangs.

All this may be easier and more stable in the burbs, but the community/village mindset does exist in SF if you seek it. It's not that there isn't crime and some troubled kids here, but there are some incredible benefits to the city as well.

This may be specific to SF as we have an insanely low kid % in SF (like 5% vs. 14% most other cities).

Re: The American Dream convinces people loneliness is normal

#112

As someone who was born in Latin America, I always find those stereotypes about America funny. If anything, Americans can't fucking leave you alone for God's sake. They need to smile at you in the street, give you good morning, invite you to their churches, and bring you a pie after you move to the neighborhood. Ok, this is more of a suburban experience. But this is also quintessential America.

That's probably a "only non-white person for several blocks" experience, if I had to guess. Behind that "wont leave you alone" is often a sort of racial fetishism or, less sinisterly, a wish to meet new and different people

Re: The American Dream convinces people loneliness is normal

#113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd call this the opposite to "lacking agency on one's life". It's not though, is it? Given that we in the United States need to earn money for everything rather than have meaningful social welfare programs means that our agency is simply "earn the most amount of money so maybe you can have a few years of peace in your 80s." which I think is the opposite of meaningful agency of one's own life.

What is the alternative offering more meaningful agency?

In order to have meaningful agency I'd imagine you'd need to have your basic needs met before you move on. So, be born wealthy and you can have all the agency you like in the US. Everyone else gets the illusion of agency.

Re: The American Dream convinces people loneliness is normal

#114

As someone who was born in Latin America, I always find those stereotypes about America funny. If anything, Americans can't fucking leave you alone for God's sake. They need to smile at you in the street, give you good morning, invite you to their churches, and bring you a pie after you move to the neighborhood. Ok, this is more of a suburban experience. But this is also quintessential America.

That's probably a "only non-white person for several blocks" experience, if I had to guess. Behind that "wont leave you alone" is often a sort of racial fetishism or, less sinisterly, a wish to meet new and different people

Not really likely. I came from German and Italian Alpine ancestry. If anything, I am probably more white than many of my former white American neighbors.

Re: The American Dream convinces people loneliness is normal

#115
post #84
post #36

Society is driving loneliness. Look at the demands of school (and after school activities for that college app) and work. Everyone is so busy that it's hard to schedule anything once you have a job, house, family, etc. You need two incomes now, so that's that's a big drain on time when the schedules don't match up.

I agree, though I wouldn't call it society. I'd call it "economy and policy". The USA has no safety nets. Getting sick could mean going bankrupt if you don't have a job with healthcare. With rents as high as they are in big cities, not having a job quickly drains your bank account. As you said, you need two incomes now. If you have a family, you might live in the suburbs which makes things worse. Suburbs can often be…

>I want to meet them at a café, a bar, or a restaurant, casually

You're talking about the sociological concept of the "third place" [0] -- not home and not work, but a hangout elsewhere.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_place

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