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The mysterious dodecahedrons of the Roman Empire

atlasobscura.com

41–50 of 103 posts

Re: The mysterious dodecahedrons of the Roman Empire

#41
Related:

No one is certain what Roman bronze dodecahedrons were used for (2018) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29717215 - Dec 2021 (207 comments)

What were these Roman objects used for? - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25237271 - Nov 2020 (37 comments)

The Mysterious Bronze Objects That Have Baffled Archaeologists for Centuries - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21439351 - Nov 2019 (7 comments)

Re: The mysterious dodecahedrons of the Roman Empire

#42
post #14
post #11

That dodecahedron featured in the first pic is swank af. Hats off to the ancients. I've crafted a few in various media. Getting it right is tricky. Really makes you appreciate 3d printing.

My guess has been that they are an item a journeyman blacksmith had to create to be promoted to master. From the photos I've seen, they're similar but not identical. So they likely aren't being made as a regular production item like nails or hinges would be.

> My guess has been that they are an item a journeyman blacksmith had to create to be promoted to master.

Seems pretty specific to span two centuries of known construction. Why would they be saved and not recycled? Nearly every medieval village had a blacksmith, with larger population centers supporting more, within the whole of medieval Europe thousands of blacksmiths at any one time, so why have only 116 of these turned up when there should be hundreds of thousands of them?

I think it's very interesting their construction appears to cease just in time for Christianity to take over Europe in the late 4th century. Previously, Rome had 12 principal deities.

Re: The mysterious dodecahedrons of the Roman Empire

#43

The article fails to mention a major hypothesis that immediately came to mind when I saw the object. Wikipedia agrees [1]: > It has also been suggested that they might have been an object to test the skill of a metalsmith, perhaps as part of a portfolio to demonstrate their capabilities to customers or as a way to qualify for a certain status in a collegium (guild). This speculation is based on the historic cost of b…

Why the specific Gallo-Roman geographic distribution? Presumably blacksmiths existed and needed "visiting cards" across the Roman Empire? As an impromptu digital armchair archeologist I'd say this very specific geographic dispersion suggests cultural / religious significance. In any case it weighs against a purely utilitarian role (that would easily diffuse across the empire). Wax residue was found inside "one or two…

Considering the size and makeup of the Roman empire, I wouldn't be surprised if there were substantial differences in every-day purely utilitarian activities for no other reason than "that's how we do it here". People didn't even speak the same language (Britain never adopted Latin as a common language, and Gaul didn't until after these devices are dated).

Unfortunately a lot of these details about every-day life are lost to history as no one bothered to write it down "as everyone already knows about it".

Re: The mysterious dodecahedrons of the Roman Empire

#44

The article fails to mention a major hypothesis that immediately came to mind when I saw the object. Wikipedia agrees [1]: > It has also been suggested that they might have been an object to test the skill of a metalsmith, perhaps as part of a portfolio to demonstrate their capabilities to customers or as a way to qualify for a certain status in a collegium (guild). This speculation is based on the historic cost of b…

I think the major argument against this theory is the map, as the article states. Most of the theories for their use are actually invalid simply by looking at the map of finds.

Fishing, toys, music, games, things that were global in the roman empire.

What the map shows is that it was used in the colder parts of the empire.

Re: The mysterious dodecahedrons of the Roman Empire

#45
post #40

It’s a chandelier/candle holder or heating device, is it not? Wax was even found on one. The different size holes accommodate different candle sizes. They were made with a copper alloy and thus conduct heat efficiently. That also aligns with the reasoning used to justify the gloves theory (i.e. they were primarily found in colder climates).

This is interesting, but at least one of them seems to have no holes at all: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:2018_Rheinisches_Lan... Also not convinced it will be all that stable as a candle holder.

Maybe it wasn't finished? And the ones out of stone could be a poor persons attempt, because stone also retains heat.

I actually like any theory related to heat because that's what the map indicates. Any other theory is related to things and actions that were common throughout the empire.

Re: The mysterious dodecahedrons of the Roman Empire

#46
post #40

It’s a chandelier/candle holder or heating device, is it not? Wax was even found on one. The different size holes accommodate different candle sizes. They were made with a copper alloy and thus conduct heat efficiently. That also aligns with the reasoning used to justify the gloves theory (i.e. they were primarily found in colder climates).

This is interesting, but at least one of them seems to have no holes at all: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:2018_Rheinisches_Lan... Also not convinced it will be all that stable as a candle holder.

The one without holes looks like an icosahedron (20 sides)

Re: The mysterious dodecahedrons of the Roman Empire

#50

It’s a chandelier/candle holder or heating device, is it not? Wax was even found on one. The different size holes accommodate different candle sizes. They were made with a copper alloy and thus conduct heat efficiently. That also aligns with the reasoning used to justify the gloves theory (i.e. they were primarily found in colder climates).

It’s a chandelier/candle holder or heating device, is it not?

I'd love to have a replica for that purpose, I wonder if someone makes them.

Edit: of course they do, one search away. A nice conversation starter :)

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