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Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

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Re: Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

#291

Post by ant6n »

prottog wrote: post #268
zer0tonin wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

3 things: - the culture is not the same as the US. French people tend to be very financially risk-averse - the VC eco-system in France exists but it is trash - people who have the skills to create startups in France tend to do it outside of France because they will have access to better capital/labor markets (for example, DataDog and Docker both have french founders)

> the culture is not the same as the US. French people tend to be very financially risk-averse Interesting, given the number of people who claim that better social benefits in the US would encourage more startups and other business formation.

There is no such claim. Id claim that a system that helps all of of society by providing health, employment, income, childcare, housing and transportation security isn’t necessarily completely toxic for a small number of Startup founders, as a system. Since it also may help founders to an extent. Its about individual risks that are possible.

The problem in Germany and France is the VC and business culture, but thats not primarily a result of income taxes.

Re: Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

#292

Post by rcarmo »

UncleMeat wrote: post #284
908B64B197 wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really luck? Where's the European phone, the European OS. European Cloud? ChatGPT? American engineers and companies provide the bulk of tech's value added. > Whereas in Europe we're lucky to get $80k in the same jobs, and then the state steals half of that :/ Are those really the same jobs?

Europeans work at all of these companies.

And they either moved to the US or are putting up with earning less than half what their US counterparts do.

Re: Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

#293

Post by bradhe »

kbos87 wrote: post #68
fmajid wrote: post #21

Many are going to start their own startups and the seeds for the next Cambrian explosion are being cast today, just as they were in 2001–2003 or 2008. That said not all Big Tech employees can deal with the hustle required at a startup.

I’m skeptical that the same patterns we saw in the early 2000s are going to play out again. Last time, tech was in its infancy. There was a small universe of people who understood baseline concepts like getting to product market fit, how to measure and implement growth patterns, etc etc. Today these are practically household concepts, and they have been for years. There aren’t a few hundred other people in SV you are…

Agreed. The type of employee at big tech today is a lot different than what once was. But given the volume perhaps the output will be similar.

Re: Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

#294

Post by ActorNightly »

zer0tonin wrote: post #109
nicenewtemp84 wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When layoffs happened in the past, they were laying off old school enthusiasts because the companies just weren't working. Now, they are laying off people that went into tech because it seemed like easy money. It's not the same caliber of tech person.

This claim is completely un-substantiated. Many people around me who have been laid-off are extremely talented engineers.

Its somewhat substantiated by the fact that getting into modern big tech is pretty much focusing on the interview process, which has almost zero to do with actual real world development.

Furthermore, having worked in big tech, most of the roles that are getting filled are essentially "busy work" - i.e here is a entire proprietary build system, barebones service and deployment pipeline, all you have to do is add logic. Someone who has worked in this type of environment isn't going to succeed at a startup where you have to build systems from scratch.

Re: Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

#295

Post by ActorNightly »

iancmceachern wrote: post #121
_vbnz wrote: post #29

American engineers are lucky to earn enough to be able to save up and do stuff like this, like on $200k you can save enough to really try a start-up for a year or two. Whereas in Europe we're lucky to get $80k in the same jobs, and then the state steals half of that :/

We also have to pay a lot more out of pocket for basic services like healthcare,, transportation, childcare, etc.

In EU, you also pay for healthcare and transport, just indirectly in the form of taxes, which is why tax rates are much higher.

There is a cross over point for salary in US where below that, it becomes advantageous to live in EU, but tech salaries are well above this point.

Re: Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

#296

Post by ActorNightly »

lghh wrote: post #159
boc wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re paying for healthcare at a tech company? Usually your company provides this as a benefit. Same for commuter subsidies.

Even with best-in-class health insurance in the US, one "gotcha" leaves you with an unpayable bill. Usually, your company provides health insurance. Health insurance != health care. Larger companies (I assume this translates to tech) will also usually have a clinic on-site for smaller things and it's heavily subsidized or free. None of this prevents you from 6-figure debt for something like a difficult, but largely b…

>one "gotcha" leaves you with an unpayable bill

It is next to unheard of to have an extremely large bill if you have good health insurance. Even if you do, at tech levels of salary, if you were to effectively save the extra money, you should have no problems covering it.

Re: Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

#297

Post by virtualritz »

yamtaddle wrote: post #114
virtualritz wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The poor in America are far richer than the poor in most other countries. You probably mean the US/Canada. 'America' includes South America for which this is not generally true. However, replace 'America' in your sentence with any developed country and the statement is indeed generally true. And thusly of little value to this discussion. Specifically it doesn't change the fact that the poor in the US are much poore…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States > The United States of America (U.S.A. or USA), commonly known as the United States (U.S. or US) or America > Demonym(s) American[b][8] Pretending not to understand this is tiresome.

It's more tiresome that US citizens claim the term and do not understand the issue with it. [1]

As a European traveling to South America frequently it is very obvious to me why all my friends there take issue with this. As a European this is also not my fight but I do take sides nevertheless.

From my post getting three down votes, two of which I must assume stem from this topic at least, I dare only conclude that the sensitivity is mutual.

So probably worth understanding and showing some consideration. Beers!

[1] https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2013/06/what-do...

Re: Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

#298

Post by pydry »

marcosdumay wrote: post #153
kbos87 wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m skeptical that the same patterns we saw in the early 2000s are going to play out again. Last time, tech was in its infancy. There was a small universe of people who understood baseline concepts like getting to product market fit, how to measure and implement growth patterns, etc etc. Today these are practically household concepts, and they have been for years. There aren’t a few hundred other people in SV you are…

> there’s a tried and true playbook that large tech companies quickly put to use to capture any remotely adjacent areas Hum... The reason why large companies have historically been unable to do that is because nobody in them bothers to do it, not because they don't know how. And one of the consequences of a series of mass layoffs is exactly that people stop caring about things like this.

Or, to put it succinctly - Google took off because Yahoo didnt particularly want to be a search engine.

Re: Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

#299

Post by pydry »

NearAP wrote: post #195
aledalgrande wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most big tech employees are not startup people. That's why they work at big tech.

You can't necessarily reach that conclusion. Big tech employs more people than startups, which means it's more likely for someone to get a job at big tech than a startup. It's just a law of numbers and has nothing to do with whether they're suited for startup life or big tech life. In addition, in the US, foreign students who just graduated are more likely to get a job at big tech than startup because more big tech s…

Some of them are startup people, but the ones who have ground through a degree and leetcode before landing a job maintaining an esoteric part of Big G's internal systems assuredly aren't.

Re: Startups Are Scooping Up Big Tech’s Cast-Off Workers

#300

Post by jen20 »

thephyber wrote: post #164
cjdoc29 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you expand on the "at least half" part? On an income of $200k in California, for example, your tax rate is something like 8% (marginal). If you total it up with federal taxes, it's something like a 27% tax rate.

Most likely your parent misunderstands the _marginal_ income tax rates. That said, income tax is not the only kind of tax. In the US, federated government entities mean a mesh of taxes accumulate. Income tax + Payroll Tax + Social Security + Medicare + Property Tax + Sales Tax aggregate. CA and NY are a little higher than other competing states, but not by much.

Property tax is the one that people always forget in the US - especially when looking at places with “low” overall tax rates like Texas.
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