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Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

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Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#251

Post by viraptor »

dkarras wrote: post #221
dig1 wrote: post #10

Yet CEO's bonus in 2022 was 20x bigger than his salary. I don't think it will be less this year either; with all-time high stock price and these "cost cuts", he will be wholesomely rewarded.

I don't get the obsession with CEO salaries. Envy is not a productive way of thinking about economics. In a huge company, distribute the CEO compensation to employees and it will be peanuts (in microsoft's case, it is something like $200 per employee - not per month or anything, that is the total). I don't get it. If all the CEOs in the world were forced to make $0, it will not meaningfully change the amount of money…

It sets the tone and it's unlikely that just the CEO gets bonuses like that. If the exec salaries/bonuses were tied to all the other salary adjustments, the incentives to care about workers would be better too.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#252

Post by blackoil »

slg wrote: post #169
oh_sigh wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The company and its income is for the benefit of the shareholders, not the employees. Maybe the argument can be made that they should pay more money to certain people to improve their future income, but that has nothing to do with how much money they make.

Capitalism really breaks people's brains sometimes. It isn't about who owns the profit. An employer/employee relationship is a business agreement. That includes an implicit (and sometimes explicit) agreement to regularly reevaluate employee compensation based off a combination of employee and company performance. This decision severs that connection. Now there is no level of employee performance which can yield bette…

> That includes an implicit (and sometimes explicit) agreement to regularly reevaluate employee compensation based off a combination of employee and company performance.

It ain't a 2 variable equation, like all resources it is also driven by market. If Meta/Goog/industry is hiring at 20% higher the salaries have to go up to match or you'll see huge attrition.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#253

Post by UncleMeat »

oh_sigh wrote: post #140
slg wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is worse from a corporate greed perspective because it is effectively saying that Microsoft can't afford to give out a pay raise to anyone. Meanwhile, they had a net income of $17.6 billion last quarter[1]. A layoff can at least be due to a change in direction or some departments, teams, or employees not delivering the necessary value to justify their continued employment. This is saying no one at Microsoft is d…

The company and its income is for the benefit of the shareholders, not the employees. Maybe the argument can be made that they should pay more money to certain people to improve their future income, but that has nothing to do with how much money they make.

We’ve broken our society to think this. Shareholders should be third, after customers and employees. Or at the very least we need to ban the phrase “job creators” for the rest of time if employers are just supposed to stomp on their employees whenever possible.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#254

Post by krainboltgreene »

dkarras wrote: post #221
dig1 wrote: post #10

Yet CEO's bonus in 2022 was 20x bigger than his salary. I don't think it will be less this year either; with all-time high stock price and these "cost cuts", he will be wholesomely rewarded.

I don't get the obsession with CEO salaries. Envy is not a productive way of thinking about economics. In a huge company, distribute the CEO compensation to employees and it will be peanuts (in microsoft's case, it is something like $200 per employee - not per month or anything, that is the total). I don't get it. If all the CEOs in the world were forced to make $0, it will not meaningfully change the amount of money…

> Envy is not a productive way of thinking about economics.

This is an incredibly uncharitable way to frame the parent comment.

> If all the CEOs in the world were forced to make $0, it will not meaningfully change the amount of money in workers' pockets.

That's just not true.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#255

Post by CapsAdmin »

pb7 wrote: post #230
BulgarianIdiot wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Employees get both options and grants, depending on their position and so on. And stock does go up. It's Microsoft. Otherwise you can... just not use the option. The purpose is to encourage employees to help the company and raise the stock. In theory at least.

Thanks for explaining it but I know how it works better than most here, hence the comment. If you get $100K in stock options at a certain price and the price doubles, you make $100K. If it stays the same, you make nothing. If you leave, you have a certain period of time to exercise or you lose your options. If you get $100K in stock and the prices doubles you make $200K. If it stays the same, you make $100K. If you l…

I know almost nothing about this, so as far as I understand stock options are like stock except they start from "0" and you can only cash out the positive difference?

Like you can only earn from the company's future growth.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#256

Post by dclowd9901 »

pydry wrote: post #206
scruple wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. Wealth and power are concentrated and do not need to be coordinated. Their individual actions and self-interests organically merge to maintain the state of affairs that keeps them wealthy and in power.

They kind of do. If Facebook and Google suppress their wages and some other company poaches their best people the buying cartel could easily fall apart. OPEC suffered from exactly this problem quite early on. It only takes a few defectors of sufficient size.

Ah yes, OPEC, that organization that is poor and enjoys no power whatsoever.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#257

Post by waiseristy »

dkarras wrote: post #221
dig1 wrote: post #10

Yet CEO's bonus in 2022 was 20x bigger than his salary. I don't think it will be less this year either; with all-time high stock price and these "cost cuts", he will be wholesomely rewarded.

I don't get the obsession with CEO salaries. Envy is not a productive way of thinking about economics. In a huge company, distribute the CEO compensation to employees and it will be peanuts (in microsoft's case, it is something like $200 per employee - not per month or anything, that is the total). I don't get it. If all the CEOs in the world were forced to make $0, it will not meaningfully change the amount of money…

Is the CEO some sacred object that should be treated differently than any other part of the org? Just because there are a handful of C-level execs, they deserve 20,000% bonuses while the rest of the org skimps?

It’s about equality, attributing it to ‘envy’ reeks of entitlement.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#258

Post by UncleMeat »

WalterBright wrote: post #201
mupuff1234 wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why doesn't the same apply to Satya?

Google sez: "Of this total $2,500,000 was received as a salary, $10,066,500 was received as a bonus, $0 was received in stock options, $42,269,560 was awarded as stock and $110,250 came from other types of compensation." Set this against the several hundreds of billions added to the MSFT value during his reign, and his compensation is the bargain of the century. As a longtime MSFT shareholder, Nadella's compensation…

Sure. He gets a fat bonus because the stock is up. You still aren’t explaining why this doesn’t apply to the rest of the workers.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#259

Post by krainboltgreene »

nineplay wrote: post #150
boredumb wrote: post #32

HN comments about profits, CEOs, share holders and executives are increasingly resembling twitter takes.

I'm so bored with these comments. Companies care more about profits than people - can we put it on a banner somewhere so we all get over it?

Shareholders care more about profits and than people. Coops and nationalized companies do just fine at caring about people.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#260

Post by lolstock »

paulpauper wrote: post #248

just buy the stock, which keeps going up....this is effectively the same as a raise. Profit that would go to employees goes to shareholders. It's like a conservation law.

If a raise was a gamble in either direction then sure. There are numerous aspects that could drive MSFT lower, its trading near 45% higher than January, presumably based on ChatGPT, if that enthusiasm pops you'll see a dive.
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