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Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

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Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#201

Post by WalterBright »

mupuff1234 wrote: post #198
WalterBright wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They get the rise in the value of their MSFT stock options. Microsoft has historically had low salaries - because the money was made from the stock options.

So why doesn't the same apply to Satya?

Google sez:

"Of this total $2,500,000 was received as a salary, $10,066,500 was received as a bonus, $0 was received in stock options, $42,269,560 was awarded as stock and $110,250 came from other types of compensation."

Set this against the several hundreds of billions added to the MSFT value during his reign, and his compensation is the bargain of the century.

As a longtime MSFT shareholder, Nadella's compensation is coming out of my pocket. I don't begrudge him a penny of it.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#202

Post by csa »

fzeroracer wrote: post #186
csa wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My thesis is that many of them, especially at places that grew a lot during covid like MS, were/are overpaid relative to their skill set / ability to add value. Cutting positions was one way to correct this. Freezing salaries is another. If any devs hired during covid think that their salary was totally justified and shouldn’t be cut directly or indirectly, then they are more likely than not delusional. It was a frot…

Okay, but there's a core flaw in your argument: Microsoft has already cut jobs, and now they're freezing salaries for everyone. You're effectively trying to say that everyone at Microsoft deserves a pay cut and that their salary is unjustified, which seems a fair bit more delusional. It seems to me you're working backwards from the position of 'Microsoft is justified in what they're doing' and then continuing to adju…

> You're effectively trying to say that everyone at Microsoft deserves a pay cut and that their salary is unjustified

Key employees and high performers will be rewarded at MS and elsewhere. It just won’t be announced in a press release.

If you want to disagree with me or think that what I say is bullshit, that’s fine. The market will have the final say. I’m just a pundit on a message board.

Imho, this move by MS, which will probably be followed by others, is just them exercising their options on their side of the labor market.

If folks don’t like it, they can leave and/or change careers.

There will almost certainly be a little bit of collateral damage, but I imagine that most of the high value-add people will be happy with their pay packages while keeping their mouths shut.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#203

Post by oblio »

letsdothisagain wrote: post #151
galoisscobi wrote: post #15

Wondering how long it’ll take for other tech companies to copy this move and pretend that they independently arrived at these conclusions after their meticulous macroeconomic analysis.

I mean, this is just MS copying everyone else. There is no "real" recession. It's basically a loosely coordinated capital strike to counteract post-pandemic wage growth. Jay will keep raising rates until those wages stop climbing, and companies are taking the hint. If anything MS is smarter for waiting for all of their competitors to cut first. As others pointed out, they have tons of cash and really don't have to cu…

The funky thing is... it's not a recession for them. All of their incomes are growing and their profits are reasonably steady, except for "I take full responsibility for the Metaverse" Meta.

They don't really need to do this, they want to.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#204

Post by ChicagoDave »

And the IT industry thought job hopping was bad enough.

Wait until the market leans towards talent again. Everyone will be accepting the highest bids.

They may have erased a 5% raise this year, but lose it (and more) in new hires in a year or two.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#205

Post by oblio »

DiggyJohnson wrote: post #154
jhp123 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all large tech employers play follow the leader then it's not natural reversion, it's a textbook example of tacit oligopoly coordination.

Or the pattern is due to a common cause between the high tech firms, and we know what that common cause is: they overhired 2020-2022.

Look at their revenues in 2019 and in 2023.

Except for Failed Metaverse Inc, everyone else has grown revenue proportionally and profits decent enough.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#206

Post by pydry »

scruple wrote: post #200
csa wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn’t take illegal back channel coordination to play follow the leader. All it takes is one major company to pull the trigger, then the rest will follow. The hiring market during covid was wonky in a way that favored applicants, and a lot of folks who got hired were under-qualified, overpaid, or both. This is just a natural reversion to a more balanced state across the industry.

Right. Wealth and power are concentrated and do not need to be coordinated. Their individual actions and self-interests organically merge to maintain the state of affairs that keeps them wealthy and in power.

They kind of do. If Facebook and Google suppress their wages and some other company poaches their best people the buying cartel could easily fall apart.

OPEC suffered from exactly this problem quite early on. It only takes a few defectors of sufficient size.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#207

Post by rtkwe »

tivert wrote: post #187
rtkwe wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More than that there's a whole strain of performative cost cutting due to the recession that's always seemed just over the horizon for the last year. Part of the goal is just to signal to investors you're ready for this continuously hypothetical event by pre tightening your belt as a company so they don't "price in" the recession into your stock. It's another negative outcome of basing so much of our evaluation of co…

> More than that there's a whole strain of performative cost cutting due to the recession that's always seemed just over the horizon for the last year. You can say that again. I've spent last 3 months dealing with the effects of some pretty severe cost-cutting on my team. Now I recently learned my employers is going to spend billions on stock buy-backs. That's just great news after the most recent push to increase ou…

The juxtaposition of record profits, stock buybacks, and "we're not just raising prices because we can it's inflation for us too" is pretty telling. I often find myself wishing courts/government could just cut through the posturing on stuff like this and call bullshit, like the ever present promises of lower consumer prices during mergers because that's the magic test and courts are seemingly required to swallow whatever thin veneer companies promise. You don't need tax breaks you spent the last 3 on stock buybacks!

Anyways need to stop before this becomes more of a rambling rant. My work is also doing the occasional required week for "collaboration" but they've paused at 1 week a month for now. Have to justify this campus somehow... I like to think every manager bubbling up complaints actually got someone to listen but I'm betting they haven't changed their mind on the long term push even though we've shuttered 2 other locations in my area to consolidate people.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#208

Post by fingerlocks »

efields wrote: post #68
WalterBright wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> getting way too much money compared to the rest of society A good engineer can make a great deal of money for the company, far more than a plumber ever could. I.e. an engineer has leverage .

The plumber at the house with an overflowing toilet sure has some leverage, too.

I mean, not really. Every house has a main water shutoff valve. You can watch a 5 minute YouTube video on how to snake a toilet yourself. Or spend an hour installing a new toilet.

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#209

Post by brewdad »

wadd1e wrote: post #122
refulgentis wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2nd deriv is negative and we're likely to overshoot, hence, the decision and article about it

2nd derivative being negative doesn't mean inflation is becoming deflation though, it just means that the rate of change of inflation is decreasing, but the inflation(and rate of change of inflation)itself will still be positive(unless I'm misunderstanding something, which is entirely possible).

The reported number is backward looking year-over-year. A 4.9% rate says the price of their basket of goods is that much more expensive than it was a year ago. Last month the inflation rate was 5% when compared to March of 2022. So, in a sense, goods are becoming cheaper.

In absolute terms, groceries, airline fares, new cars, hotels and household energy (such as electricity, fuel oil and utility gas service) are actually cheaper than they were a month ago[1].

[1] https://www.cnbc.com/2023/05/10/april-2023-cpi-inflation-rep...

Re: Microsoft Freezes Salaries for 2023

#210

Post by nforgerit »

fingerlocks wrote: post #208
efields wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The plumber at the house with an overflowing toilet sure has some leverage, too.

I mean, not really. Every house has a main water shutoff valve. You can watch a 5 minute YouTube video on how to snake a toilet yourself. Or spend an hour installing a new toilet.

That’s what every MBA wannabe tech startup founder is saying about using wordpress to achieve his goals.
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