Earlier quoted context omitted.
I thought commingling classification/user clearance levels on the same hardware fell out of favor a while ago, because of side channels (with speculative execution being the final nail in the coffin.) Isn't seL4 more used for things like data diodes, cryptographic equipment and military hardware? Stuff that you need to keep from getting hacked or malfunctioning, but not time-shared with untrusted users.
Nah, multilevel security fell out of favor because no large commercial vendor could do it. They retracted the requirements over a decade ago because it prevented Microsoft and IBM from bidding on government contracts to “secure” their infrastructure.
ACM Software System Award Given to seL4 Microkernel
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Re: ACM Software System Award Given to seL4 Microkernel
#42Earlier quoted context omitted.
Google's Fuchsia OS uses a microkernel: https://fuchsia.dev/fuchsia-src/concepts/kernel
Microkernels by themselves are not special; SeL4 is because it's proven to be secure.
Re: ACM Software System Award Given to seL4 Microkernel
#43I would love to see Qubes rebuilt on this
Re: ACM Software System Award Given to seL4 Microkernel
#44Earlier quoted context omitted.
Apple doesn't use sel4 in the secure enclave, but instead another l4 variant that isn't formally verified. And they've made a lot of pretty deep changes for example adding native support for Mach-O files.
What is a macho file?
Re: ACM Software System Award Given to seL4 Microkernel
#45Congratulations, well deserved! Also in memoriam Jochen Liedtke [0], who started the L4 kernel project and rekindled research in microkernels by showing that they don't have to be slow ('slow' as in Mach's long IPC latencies). [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jochen_Liedtke
Re: ACM Software System Award Given to seL4 Microkernel
#46Every year I’m reminded how diverse the recipients of this award are. You have a provably correct microkernel, DNS, Wireshark, and Jupyter Notebooks all being recognized as significant software systems.
Re: ACM Software System Award Given to seL4 Microkernel
#47Makes me wonder when we finally get proper government funding of FOSS projects.
> seL4 is the result of big investments. Firstly by the Australian tax payers, who (through NICTA) funded its creation, and (through NICTA and then CSIRO’s Data61) continued supporting it. Over the past 6 years, US taxpayers (mostly through DARPA, but also other parts of the DoD as well as DHS) invested a lot in completing and extending the verification story, as well as deploying on real-world systems. And most recently, HENSOLDT Cyber funded verification of the RISC-V port of the kernel.
Re: ACM Software System Award Given to seL4 Microkernel
#48Re: ACM Software System Award Given to seL4 Microkernel
#49Is there a seL4 implementation targeted at, like, dinking around on some desktop, or is this stuff mostly interesting to embedded-ish folks?
Maybe an ARM desktop once multi core is implemented and verified. Verifying the whole thing for x86 seems scary. It is a kind of undertaking that gives normal people a glimpse of how ADHD is. It is a huge task and I would not know how to structure it, where to start and how to predict and plan all the intermediate steps.
The verification story is currently stronger with RISC-V.
Considering close cooperation between seL4 and RISC-V projects, ARM aka the legacy architecture is unlikely to be a priority anytime soon.
Re: ACM Software System Award Given to seL4 Microkernel
#50I would love to see Qubes rebuilt on this
Makatea[0] is trying to do something like that. 0. https://trustworthy.systems/projects/TS/makatea