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MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

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Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#391
When trying to get GPT Bing, I let Microsoft set the defaults like they insisted.

It was such an awful experience.

>desktop ads

>Edge opens, edge ads

>Bing default browser, ads

>start menu ads

More on their products:

>Sharepoint, 3 different versions, terrible documentation. Impossible to develop for when you have forum posts describing different software with the same name.

>Power Automate, No I don't want drag and drop. Never ever. Further, we did do the drag and drop, only to run into issues and have to trick the software into showing some hidden ID that we could later copypaste. They even tease you with the actual code under the hood. I want to add a new line character, so easy in programming, (seems) impossible in power automate.

I have decided its urgent to make the full transition to Linux. Microsoft constantly seems to be fine with a terrible user experience. They are a giant. They remind me of Apple with their marketing/sales first mentality.

EDIT: (warning rage) Somehow edge opened up again. I lost my mind. I spent 5 minutes trying to uninstall without typing in some obscenely long version number. Nope. Impossible. Serious FU to M$.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#392
post #52

If shit hits the fan and Microsoft gets sued for Anti Competitive behaviour (again) I suspect their main defence would be: Google doesn't even let users uninstall their apps and apple doesn't even let users install other browser.

I don't use Windows, but can you fully uninstall Defender (or whatever it's called) in Windows 10/11, never have malicious software something scanner or updates run automatically?

Only with severe hacking and/or enterprise management via group policy.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#393

I have no skin in the game, but even I am starting to think the obvious thing here: Apple and Google own the entire mobile OS market. They could literally destroy Microsoft if they started to hugely degrade the experience of Microsoft products on iOS and Android with dark patterns a la Microsoft. But they don't. So far they were competing by making their own products better. Microsoft needs to think hard how hostile…

> They could literally destroy Microsoft if they started to hugely degrade the experience of Microsoft products on iOS and Android with dark patterns a la Microsoft.

I have been investing in MSFT under the assumption that they have completely abandoned these markets. What mobile market does Microsoft require when they have an increasing number of SMBs locked entirely into their death star?

> given up on making products which people enjoy to use

Building new apps in with .NET/Azure/GitHub is a dream. The laser focus of the tech community on principled Windows OS issues and other product concerns is completely missing the overarching universe that is being forged by Microsoft.

Azure in 2023 is like Disneyland for a SMB CTO/CIO. If you go all-in you can actually enjoy your weekends and auditors can't really figure out how to ruin your free time as much as they used to be able to. Sure, there are specific technological or economic things that might be better on-prem (or in a different cloud), but overall I have never seen something this unified, stable, confidence-inspiring, etc.

I believe that the first cloud which can be largely delegated out to non-wizards is going to be the one that wipes the floor with the others. I suspect Microsoft is already hard at work integrating the LLM features they acquired into their Azure administration use cases. Simply having a bot integrated into the portal that can provide suggested configurations in a few hotspots (e.g. make a VM like XYZ but with ABC changes) would be incredible.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#394

I think this is being wrongly frame. This functionality is actually needed in highly regulated industries like banking or government. Which is, you need a way to secure how your employees are accessing information. And when everything is moving to becoming a cloud document (or document hosted on the cloud), not being able to have control over the browser in which that information is viewed with is a huge threat vecto…

No, it's absolutely the right framing.

This isn't a setting that allows admins to force a browser for security.

This is obviously about MS trying to force the uptake of Edge and nothing more.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#395

I have no skin in the game, but even I am starting to think the obvious thing here: Apple and Google own the entire mobile OS market. They could literally destroy Microsoft if they started to hugely degrade the experience of Microsoft products on iOS and Android with dark patterns a la Microsoft. But they don't. So far they were competing by making their own products better. Microsoft needs to think hard how hostile…

There's even a Simpsons episode about it: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TANRRhdncHc

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But they didn’t. There were PWAs of the most popular Google products that worked just fine in Windows Phone. Microsoft didn’t do the same with theirs. Outlook didn’t get an Android version until late 2015, Edge took a few years to arrive, and Bing Maps never made it.

Google did user agent detection and would actively redirect Windows Phone users to degraded experience versions of things like YouTube and Maps even if the full versions would work fine.

> ... even if the full versions would work fine

That's quite a statement, given that Internet Explorer didn't support WebGL, nor rich HTML5 video reproduction, until 2014 [0]. They are needed for the full versions of Google Maps and YouTube, respectively.

Microsoft did create a YouTube app, but it filtered out video ads, which didn't sit quite well with Google [1]

It looks to me that the pain was self inflicted.

[0] https://www.cnet.com/tech/tech-industry/windows-phone-8-1-fe...

[1] http://allaboutwindowsphone.com/features/item/24422_Thestate...

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can install any keyboard I want as long as it's just a skin on their keyboard. As an iOS app dev with a hobby project iOS keyboard, this is false. Third party iOS keyboards have just as much control over the keyboard UI and how each key (if it even has keys — your “keyboard” can be literally anything) interacts with text as a full fledged app does. In fact there is no way to “skin” the standard keyboard, but I wi…

I'm extremely interested in this; how come none of the keyboards I've tried depart from the same layout as Apple? Is it strict adherence to guidelines rather than technical restriction then? To wit, some of the features that same-named apps/keyboards give me on android but not on iPhone include "hold key for alternative character" or button to "force" numpad. As well all keyboards I've tried have same layout and sizi…

I don't think there's much, if anything, in the way of App Store guidelines for keyboards except that they do things with the text field the user currently has highlighted.

For instance the app Fantastical comes with a "keyboard" that inputs dates that are open on your calendar[0] and there exist a few rather nonstandard keyboards like Typewise[1].

Absence of features common on Android boards I would guess comes down to those patterns not being familiar to (and thus, not desired by) iOS users or in some cases software patents (there have been a few cases of keyboard devs receiving cease and desist notices from patent holders for using some UI pattern).

[0]: https://flexibits.com/img/help/fantastical-ios/en/f3-opening... [1]: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/typewise-custom-keyboard/id147...

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#398

I have no skin in the game, but even I am starting to think the obvious thing here: Apple and Google own the entire mobile OS market. They could literally destroy Microsoft if they started to hugely degrade the experience of Microsoft products on iOS and Android with dark patterns a la Microsoft. But they don't. So far they were competing by making their own products better. Microsoft needs to think hard how hostile…

> But they don't.

I mean, they actually do though. Apple and Google both do similar things, they just get less media coverage because they are seen as normal to the mobile ecosystem, while this seems abnormal because it's in a desktop environment. That's no excuse for Microsoft, I wish they'd stop doing some of this garbage, but to act like Apple and Google have clean hands is laughable.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#399

Windows is not unhackable. This one's easy. Deleting all instances of the msedge executable does not break Windows. Don't depend on settings, they're not reliable or comprehensive, and it's far more work to track them all down and maintain their value than it is to simply delete the problem. Some "features" will stop working. The article's example is one of many. Windows will now use your chosen applications if it ca…

Now do this, but at scale.

I cannot fathom the number of support requests coming in as soon as some features stop working, in a fleet of hundreds. Dealing with thousands is a great recipe for disaster.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree with your premise. I have an iPhone (forced upon me by work) and it's ridiculous how many links still try to open in safari or Apple maps. I've tried to configure it for years and I've literally uninstalled Apple maps, but half the time iPhone keeps wanting me to reinstall it when I click a link or address. And a lot of url links open in safari instead of chrome or Firefox. Same with many other things - I…

You sound like a person who never even tried. Open Settings > Safari > Default Browser App, and select the app you want. It's really that easy.

I suppose you aren't aware that they are all the same browser because apple doesn't allow competing browser engines
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