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MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

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Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#331

Post by easton »

zelphirkalt wrote: post #138
npteljes wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

VS Codium and other forks don't (maybe can't) use the official VSCode extension market. Because a lot of goodness, like the ability to refactor and debug PHP, is coming from the extensions and the extension ecosystem, it can be a big deal.

However, one can still add that marketplace, if one wants to do so. So people could still have access to the same extensions (which might be a privacy and telemetry or spyware risk), but at least not have the in-built telemetry.

From a random VSCode SSH session I have open:

> Found running server...

>

> *

> * Visual Studio Code Server

> *

> * By using the software, you agree to

> * the Visual Studio Code Server License Terms (https://aka.ms/vscode-server-license) and

> * the Microsoft Privacy Statement (https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-US/privacystatement).

> *

>

Many of the interesting extensions (Microsoft's language plugins, the remote extension pack, the .NET debugger) are licensed only for use with Visual Studio Code. Even if you hook into the VSCode marketplace, they could sue. They probably won't unless you're rehosting VSCode externally or something, but the risk is something most companies probably don't want to take when the software is free as in beer anyway for the "real" builds. (And if you're telemetry sensitive... just block the domains? I know, easier said than done, but you can do it.)

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#332

Post by weberer »

kps wrote: post #292
dathinab wrote: post #178

So anyone still thinking MS is now all good and it's not an issue that it own github + vscode + a endless list of other things relevant for especially smaller development companies? Microsoft will do whats best for them. Temporary this includes embrace open source to some degree and being reasonable nice to Linux. For example WSL can help with trying out Linux and help cross platform devs on Windows to develop for Li…

I suspect VSCode is a baited hook. Get enough developers dependent on it, then degrade it on Linux, and offer WSL as close enough to have people switch their OS rather than their editor. With developers on Windows, cloud follows.

They've already been doing this with Teams. Their native Linux client has less features, like screen blurring, or being able to view more than 4 users at a time. Thankfully you can get around this by using the web version, but who knows how long it will be until they do some user-agent shenanigans to mess with you again.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#333

Post by anaganisk »

dathinab wrote: post #178

So anyone still thinking MS is now all good and it's not an issue that it own github + vscode + a endless list of other things relevant for especially smaller development companies? Microsoft will do whats best for them. Temporary this includes embrace open source to some degree and being reasonable nice to Linux. For example WSL can help with trying out Linux and help cross platform devs on Windows to develop for Li…

Ummm, Github runs on Git. So any feature supported by git will work work with any client other than the official windows client.

Vscode is a text editor/IDE, it has bajillion alternatives, again unless MS doesn't allow code not written in Vscode to GitHub, which is a suicide anyway. There is Bitbucket or Gitlab to fork to.

WSL, is awesome, because Linux is not game friendly, yeah yeah proton blah blah. I own a steam deck I know how it works and for a casual user Linux gaming just isn't there unless you want to tinker a lot. Then there are products like Photoshop replacements for which Linux is sub par, no GIMP is not alternative, it's entirely different. But nothing is stopping other users to switch to Linux unless edge/windows 11 blackholes insert_your_favorite_linux.com. WSL just clicked for a reason.

MS as a company will fight for market share, no company after a certain size is moral, it's "free market" as US defines it. Change laws not companies. Regulate not ask nice. Feels like EU knows this and at least tries to twist the arms of companies where as in US it's seen as infringement of freedom.

Ms gobbling up dev community is fear mongering towards the wrong entity.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#335

Post by marcosdumay »

refulgentis wrote: post #221
mrpopo wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple blocking iPhone browsers without Webkit (excluding Chrome and Firefox). Android not exactly making it easy to change the default browser for average users either tbh Relevant XKCD https://xkcd.com/1118/

XKCD isn’t relevant to the sentence before, as comic notes, it’s about Apple. the “Android makes you tap something to change your default browser!” was some FUD that either Brave/DDG stopped spreading because it was generating backlash. Much like the “you have to confirm you enable sideloading!” alert in Android, it’s not clear what people want otherwise, a confirmation isn’t the same thing as making it difficult. I…

> a confirmation isn’t the same thing as making it difficult

The problem with sideloading on Android is that it won't accept upgrades for your applications. You will have to get them from the installer app. And then it will confirm before downloading each app. And then it will confirm before installing each app. And then it will confirm again because, well, I have no idea.

One confirmation isn't the same as making it difficult. Piles and piles of them is.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#336

Post by anaganisk »

kps wrote: post #292
dathinab wrote: post #178

So anyone still thinking MS is now all good and it's not an issue that it own github + vscode + a endless list of other things relevant for especially smaller development companies? Microsoft will do whats best for them. Temporary this includes embrace open source to some degree and being reasonable nice to Linux. For example WSL can help with trying out Linux and help cross platform devs on Windows to develop for Li…

I suspect VSCode is a baited hook. Get enough developers dependent on it, then degrade it on Linux, and offer WSL as close enough to have people switch their OS rather than their editor. With developers on Windows, cloud follows.

WSL is a literal VM now, that runs based on Hyper-V afaik, if Vscode degrades on Linux, I'm just not sure how it won't affect WSL too. Whatever happened to using vim,emacs, intelliJ, or tons of other Vscode forks. Vscode is not the baited hook, it's the exclusive integrations (extensions) like remote containers, remote containers etc that are nice to have features not workflow breaking stuff.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#337

Post by ayewo »

LeifCarrotson wrote: post #203
capableweb wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Microsoft needs to think hard how hostile they want to be to its competitors and users, because two people can play this game. I don't get Microsoft, have they no pride or desire to become a great company? Have they just become content to be an old corporate software house who only manages to keep users through dark patterns and anti-competitive behaviour because they have given up on making products which people e…

> You're talking about this like Microsoft ever did anything differently than what you wrote? Since when have they focused 100% on just building great products and competing fairly? They did a wonderful job with C# and .NET Core. But you need to remember your org charts; the Edge and Windows 11 decision-makers are not the same people with the same incentives.

> They did a wonderful job with C# and .NET Core.

And VSCode. One thing all three have in common is that they are all FREE to use--they don't make Microsoft any money directly.

And, for the segment of the developer tools market that wrangles C# code, if VSCode gets too good, it becomes a threat to a cash cow: Visual Studio.

Start here: https://github.com/OmniSharp/omnisharp-vscode/issues/5276#is...

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#338

Post by dabluecaboose »

CharlesW wrote: post #294
nickjj wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The calendar schedule not being revealed is a just a privacy option, each person must opt-in to share the exact meeting details. We've done this as far as I know. We also added each other to our directory. I can see the details of other team mate's calendars in the full view but this does not show up in the mini-view when you add a guest to an event. With Google, when you create a new event and put in a user's emai…

> With MS' calendar all you see is a red block of color around the times they are not available. Only by default, which I believe your org can change. You have complete control over this for your calendar, as does everyone else. https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/office/share-your-calend... > When I click into an email the title remains bold and the inbox count doesn't decrease. Also configurable.

>> When I click into an email the title remains bold and the inbox count doesn't decrease.

>Also configurable.

Bless you! I had been angsting over this at work for years. I can't believe I didn't think to check the settings.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#339

Post by ubermonkey »

nickjj wrote: post #171

Interesting timing. 2 days ago a place I'm at switched us from Google mail + calendar + meet to Microsoft outlook + calendar + teams. I almost can't believe at how good Google's suite of tools are compared to Microsoft. I never used any of MS' office tools until a few days ago. Outlook's web app doesn't even let you click into an email to mark it as read. You have to explicitly click the mark as read button. It also…

>All you see is a blocked out amount of time

You CAN share your calendar details, but most people don't want to. I see this as a feature.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#340

Post by sphars »

aflag wrote: post #174
zelphirkalt wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not answering for the GP: There are so many people out there, who should know better, or even do know better. Yet, for whatever reason install VS Code instead of VS Codium. Even when you inform people about the existence of VS Codium, they still don't move and keep using VS Code. It is like they do not even care at all. That this is even allowed to happen in organizations is already an oversight. It should not even b…

Can you use all extensions available for vs code in vs codium? I thought the best ones, provided by ms, were vs code only.

Some extensions by Microsoft are proprietary (such as their C# debugger and C++ extension) and can only be used with VSCode. For other extensions, you may be able to use them. See the docs at https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium/blob/master/DOCS.md#ext...
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