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U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

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Re: U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In previous cases, the questions regarding rape have been phrased to be incredibly broad, to the point of straining credulity. I can't say where these particular statistics have come from, but prior statistical nonsense here has poisoned the well for me.

> the questions regarding rape have been phrased to be incredibly broad If forced sexual intercourse does not fit your definition of rape, perhaps that's what's being too narrow?

Can "forced" in this context be interpreted as "peer pressured" by the person being interviewed?

I'm not here to doubt the statistics. But when I was young peer pressure was a problem when it came to sex.

I don't know if I would consider "I was pressured by my peers to have sex, but I didn't really want to" as rape. Or at least, I don't know who the rapist would be in this case.

And it affects men too. First time I made out with a girl, I really didn't like her (as in I found her boring and not attractive). But my friends were pressuring me towards it. A few shots of vodka later, and I did what I had to do.

Re: U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

#82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the questions regarding rape have been phrased to be incredibly broad If forced sexual intercourse does not fit your definition of rape, perhaps that's what's being too narrow?

Can "forced" in this context be interpreted as "peer pressured" by the person being interviewed? I'm not here to doubt the statistics. But when I was young peer pressure was a problem when it came to sex. I don't know if I would consider "I was pressured by my peers to have sex, but I didn't really want to" as rape. Or at least, I don't know who the rapist would be in this case. And it affects men too. First time I m…

1) I think it is also pretty bad, when mental health is concerned. When you (assuming a teenage boy) were verbally forced to have sex with a girl you didn't lose anything but per Christian culture in the US a girl would. It's just a bigger deal.

2) in this case it is "physically forced", see the paper.

Re: U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

#83

> More than 1 in 10 (14%) had ever been forced to have sex 14% of all the teenage girls are raped? How is this possible? I'm really not the one to grab the pitchfork first for sure but this... I don't know... How are we okay with this?

I'd have to assume that this could include anything from what they felt was some amount of coercion or pressure to have sex up to rape.

You can not assume and look at the questions that were asked.

>Have you ever been physically forced to have sexual intercourse when you did not want to?

There, so you won't have to assume wrongly.

Sorry about the snark but my sister was raped 4 years ago. The rapist is still free. At least his daughter (same age as my sister) know about it.

Re: U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

#84
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reasonableness is hard to determine ahead of time, or even to define. Here's something I've seen happen. A couple of women in a corporate Slack channel says, hey CEO, what are you going to do to celebrate International Women's Day? Some dudes respond and say, cool, good idea but if we do something for that can we also celebrate International Men's Day? The women reply with angry face and eyeroll emojis before saying:…

Not celebrating international mens day isn't a problem (although I bet some may disagree with me). It's kind of a political take in the same vein as "Black Lives Matter" vs. the counter "White Lives Matter". Jumping into these "reactionary" mens rights positions as a counter to feminist issues is the wrong way to do it and understandably makes people a bit angry. Just as in if real life someone is telling you about a…

You're conceding the point, right? The OP asks why is the focus only on teen girls? Why not on everyone who is getting sadder? The answer is: society and especially academia is systematically biased against men for political and ideological reasons. So you respond, when men ask for equally good treatment to women that is a "political" demand that is "reactionary" and "understandably makes people a bit angry". It's a restatement of the original claim, rephrased because you seem to agree with this anti-male bias, but that doesn't change what it is.

Re: U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

#85
post #59
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't agree that this is Meta's fault. They gave females a window to the world and that made them depressed. Does this mean Meta should just close shop? Are they responsible for the mental health of their users?

I love how everyone here is blaming something different: parents, Meta, advertisement, political divisiveness, urban planning, society, lack of personal responsibility. Soon there will be more reasons, like violence and money. And they're right, sure. All of those are partially responsible. But I feel we tend to give a pass to the people who are actually producing the content that is damaging a generation and making…

[flagged]

Re: U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can "forced" in this context be interpreted as "peer pressured" by the person being interviewed? I'm not here to doubt the statistics. But when I was young peer pressure was a problem when it came to sex. I don't know if I would consider "I was pressured by my peers to have sex, but I didn't really want to" as rape. Or at least, I don't know who the rapist would be in this case. And it affects men too. First time I m…

1) I think it is also pretty bad, when mental health is concerned. When you (assuming a teenage boy) were verbally forced to have sex with a girl you didn't lose anything but per Christian culture in the US a girl would. It's just a bigger deal. 2) in this case it is "physically forced", see the paper.

1) At least were I came from, to my understanding, girls were as much pressured by their peers as boys, if not more.

2) I didn't read the paper, but if it is "physically forced to have sex", that is as unambiguous as it gets. Thanks for clarifying!

Re: U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

#87
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not celebrating international mens day isn't a problem (although I bet some may disagree with me). It's kind of a political take in the same vein as "Black Lives Matter" vs. the counter "White Lives Matter". Jumping into these "reactionary" mens rights positions as a counter to feminist issues is the wrong way to do it and understandably makes people a bit angry. Just as in if real life someone is telling you about a…

You're conceding the point, right? The OP asks why is the focus only on teen girls? Why not on everyone who is getting sadder? The answer is: society and especially academia is systematically biased against men for political and ideological reasons. So you respond, when men ask for equally good treatment to women that is a "political" demand that is "reactionary" and "understandably makes people a bit angry". It's a…

It's not so much that "academia is systematically biased against men for political and ideological reasons" as much as men themselves (as a generalized group, exceptions exist) are resistant to admitting that any of these issues are a significant problem, and asking for or seeking help for them if they were.

It's the old standard of not wanting to appear weak or needy. This is a real thing with men (as a generalized group, exceptions exist) and also plays a powerful role is shaping how society treats men's versus women's problems in this context.

Re: U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

#88
post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not celebrating international mens day isn't a problem (although I bet some may disagree with me). It's kind of a political take in the same vein as "Black Lives Matter" vs. the counter "White Lives Matter". Jumping into these "reactionary" mens rights positions as a counter to feminist issues is the wrong way to do it and understandably makes people a bit angry. Just as in if real life someone is telling you about a…

You're conceding the point, right? The OP asks why is the focus only on teen girls? Why not on everyone who is getting sadder? The answer is: society and especially academia is systematically biased against men for political and ideological reasons. So you respond, when men ask for equally good treatment to women that is a "political" demand that is "reactionary" and "understandably makes people a bit angry". It's a…

I'm not conceding any point. I am trying to say that the way the internet works inherently filters information to us based on how emotionally engaging content is. Maybe you aren't exposed to the counter points because they aren't that engaging but there's tons of research being done on men as well. Incels and Japanese Hikikomori, conspiracy theories and online extremism is more male oriented. Also, objectively there's tons of studies of the mental health effects on males online but the consensus seems to be that gaming doesn't have as a negative effect on boys as social media has for women - which a lot of boys screen time revolves around. But boys are also affected by this.

The focus only being on teen girls is objectively false. We literally have no idea what this technology is doing to us, and the research communities are scrambling to figure out the effects of social media and technology on all of us. But these are extremely time consuming and hard things to do conclusive studies on.

I do concede that girls were the first group to be broadly reported though. Probably because that age and gender group is especially vulnerable to the damages caused by social media and signs clearly starting showing up in 2012-2017 in a greater degree than boys of the same age group. Also it doesn't surprise me that a group who is constantly monitored by authority (parents and schools) are the first to be reported on. Males aged 20-60 are more likely to isolate themselves and not reach out creating far greater "dark cases".

My original point is that the internet exaggerates and selectively filters for engagement. If your knowledge on this topic is primarily from online sources optimised for engagement you have an incomplete view on the area. I'm not trying to change your mind on this topic in particular. I'm just saying that the internet inherently exaggerates and removes nuance (and I've felt a bit of that lack of nuance in your comments) and that this affects everyone and every single topic online today. Including me.

Re: U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

#89
post #71
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reasonableness is hard to determine ahead of time, or even to define. Here's something I've seen happen. A couple of women in a corporate Slack channel says, hey CEO, what are you going to do to celebrate International Women's Day? Some dudes respond and say, cool, good idea but if we do something for that can we also celebrate International Men's Day? The women reply with angry face and eyeroll emojis before saying:…

this is the hardest of all. When it comes to men's day, indeed all day is celebration of 20% higher salaries that men receive in average. OTOH, introducing men's day sounds fair as then everyone is treated equally (in this aspect) I really don't know which side of this particular debate we should support more. What I'm sure is that the topic is more delicate and complicated than having a one-sentence answer to it.

There is a "Men's day" where I live and it's not really controversial at all among the vast majority.

In fact, it's a very practical holiday that encourages male bonding and keeping long-term friendships, something lacking these days, so it's not just symbolic.

Other initiatives such as November 19 and Movember also have a lot of practical stuff, related to health.

I really don't see what's the controversy.

Re: U.S. Teen Girls Experiencing Increased Sadness and Violence

#90
post #3

It's normal for humans to compare themselves to their peers. That's how we have achieved the level of greatness that we currently enjoy: by competing. Males do it positively and females do it negatively. My theory is that this has gotten out of hand with the boom of Instagram and it shows.

> Males do it positively and females do it negatively.

Such a weird statement. I guess it has the implicit “generally”. But a lot of ways that men compete can be more negative from a physical point of view. Sure I won’t feel bad about my self but If I challenge someone’s macho in the wrong state or neighborhood I might end up with Bullet Holes in my body.

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