I’m still surprised that got swappable batteries isn’t being seen as an option for commercial. It seems like it would solve a lot of issues (Eg slow charging during peak solar, fast refueling swaps), while giving the manufacturers a subscription model which seems to be the kind of thing companies like.
Daimler is setting up a $650M charging network for commercial EVs
21–30 of 32 posts
Re: Daimler is setting up a $650M charging network for commercial EVs
#22Earlier quoted context omitted.
It’s an engineering challenge, but doable as you get about a ton of extra weight for EVs. The main mental miscalculation I think people make when they say “why not just trains” is ignoring that rail is a super conservative industry, at least in the US, and in the case of passenger rail (not on existing tracks) that building out new rail infrastructure is super expensive, particularly for HSR where rights of way have…
It makes perfect sense. Roads let people take a variety of vehicles and loads anywhere they want. Rail needs specific drivers who can strike, construction and maintenance people same, and a load of land and planning and budget to add any addition destination.
Large trucks also destroy roads at a far faster rate then they trains destroy tracks. Trucks need specific drivers to, they can strike too. The reason its harder is because there are more companies, the same could be done for rail, the system as it exists now in the US as compared to most of the world. The reason trucking is so successful is that the government spends an absolutely huge amount of money on roads from highways to local roads, in what amounts to a absolutely gigantic subsidy. Trains on the other hand are incredibly profitable industry running on decaying infrastructure (that was once funded with government grants).
Re: Daimler is setting up a $650M charging network for commercial EVs
#23Earlier quoted context omitted.
> long-haul electric trucking I wonder, does it even make sense? Long-haul (electric of course) rail + short to medium haul trucking make more sense - it would be much more efficient. Do long haul electric truck even make sense? Don't the batteries needed weigh too much?
Long haul could "work" but the effort needed is immense, compared to replacing delivery/short-haul trucking (which is doable with equipment we have today). For long-haul the best may be something like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3P_S7pL7Yg (Trains have advantages and disadvantages compared to long-haul trucks)
Or you could just really invest in rail rather then investing even more in highways.
Re: Daimler is setting up a $650M charging network for commercial EVs
#24They're being forced to do it. The natural market for EVs is a maximum of 20%. The cost/benefit is only positive for certain use cases. Ford can't sell its Lightning F150 EVs. They just had a fire on one of the holding lots too that burned a bunch of them down. I guess they'll have to take the insurance. Fun fact about EV fires: they're a chemical reaction, not an ordinary fire. Removing the oxygen source like you wo…
> The natural market for EVs is a maximum of 20%.
And yet countries in Europe have already higher then 20% of new car sales being EV and some of them without subsidies.
Ford can actually sell its F150. And lots of version of F150 and other trucks had issues that stopped production line. Its utterly irrelevant in terms of the EV debate.
> Fun fact about EV fires
Your not exactly breaking news here.
Re: Daimler is setting up a $650M charging network for commercial EVs
#25I’m still surprised that got swappable batteries isn’t being seen as an option for commercial. It seems like it would solve a lot of issues (Eg slow charging during peak solar, fast refueling swaps), while giving the manufacturers a subscription model which seems to be the kind of thing companies like.
Its a good idea exactly as long as you only think of the good thing about it and ignore the gigantic pile of technical, political, organization and infrastructure problems with it.
Some companies are trying it in the commercial space so far not much has come of it.
Re: Daimler is setting up a $650M charging network for commercial EVs
#26Earlier quoted context omitted.
It makes perfect sense. Roads let people take a variety of vehicles and loads anywhere they want. Rail needs specific drivers who can strike, construction and maintenance people same, and a load of land and planning and budget to add any addition destination.
Large trucks also destroy roads at a far faster rate then they trains destroy tracks. Trucks need specific drivers to, they can strike too. The reason its harder is because there are more companies, the same could be done for rail, the system as it exists now in the US as compared to most of the world. The reason trucking is so successful is that the government spends an absolutely huge amount of money on roads from…
I don't really see the distinction you're drawing between government subsidized roads and government subsidised tracks. And the difference is that roads are useful for everything, driven by anyone. I can't go on strike and stop myself from driving somewhere.
Re: Daimler is setting up a $650M charging network for commercial EVs
#27Earlier quoted context omitted.
Large trucks also destroy roads at a far faster rate then they trains destroy tracks. Trucks need specific drivers to, they can strike too. The reason its harder is because there are more companies, the same could be done for rail, the system as it exists now in the US as compared to most of the world. The reason trucking is so successful is that the government spends an absolutely huge amount of money on roads from…
I don't really see the distinction you're drawing between government subsidized roads and government subsidised tracks. And the difference is that roads are useful for everything, driven by anyone. I can't go on strike and stop myself from driving somewhere.
Trains in most nations are useful for everybody. And they are far more energy efficient, better for air quality and most importantly more space efficient. So when analysis what a government should invest in, it makes sense to invest in trains.
I know that you can go everywhere with your car, but what if I told you not every single person had a car. I know, I know for Americans this is very hard to understand that such a thing is possible. Roads aren't for everybody, roads are for people that can afford cars.
And roads still need to be designed far larger if you also use them for cargo, and because trucks are so heavy the need to be fix these roads very often otherwise they will lose utility for everybody.
And I don't understand the obsession with strikes that Americans seem to have. As if everywhere outside of the US nobody would ever get anywhere because everybody was always striking.
Re: Daimler is setting up a $650M charging network for commercial EVs
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
> the bespoke charger for their particular EV. What EVs would they be. At least in Europe all new EVs use CCS and most of the older ones used Type-2. They can all be charged from an ordinary 230 V, 10 A domestic supply; Schuko in Europe or BS1363 in the UK (and Ireland?).
Electric trucks have huge batteries and will need super-fast chargers to "refuel" on the road, you can't just plug them into an ordinary outlet. (Well, I guess you can , you just literally won't get anywhere.) The good news is that there's an emerging standard for this, so hopefully Daimler adopts it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megawatt_Charging_System
The remark I was responding to was clearly talking about private cars not commercial vehicles:
> the low hanging fruit remains the vast numbers of private vehicles not currently served by charging schemes. Those people are basically everyone who doesn't own a house with a garage where they can install the bespoke charger for their particular EV.
Re: Daimler is setting up a $650M charging network for commercial EVs
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't really see the distinction you're drawing between government subsidized roads and government subsidised tracks. And the difference is that roads are useful for everything, driven by anyone. I can't go on strike and stop myself from driving somewhere.
Trains in most nations are useful for everybody. And they are far more energy efficient, better for air quality and most importantly more space efficient. So when analysis what a government should invest in, it makes sense to invest in trains. I know that you can go everywhere with your car, but what if I told you not every single person had a car. I know, I know for Americans this is very hard to understand that suc…
Why are you talking about Americans?
Trains are an optimisation for where there's enough utility to cope with the massive overhead they impose. That's how they're more efficient: they are only built where there's so much demand that it's worth putting a train there. They aren't general-purpose, and they need a lot of top-down control to make happen. They aren't like roads, where you can run a bus service, ride a bike, or hop in a car and go.
Re: Daimler is setting up a $650M charging network for commercial EVs
#30Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't really see the distinction you're drawing between government subsidized roads and government subsidised tracks. And the difference is that roads are useful for everything, driven by anyone. I can't go on strike and stop myself from driving somewhere.
Trains in most nations are useful for everybody. And they are far more energy efficient, better for air quality and most importantly more space efficient. So when analysis what a government should invest in, it makes sense to invest in trains. I know that you can go everywhere with your car, but what if I told you not every single person had a car. I know, I know for Americans this is very hard to understand that suc…
Why are you talking about Americans?
Trains are an optimisation for where there's enough utility to cope with the massive overhead they impose. That's how they're more efficient: they are only built where there's so much demand that it's worth putting a train there. They aren't general-purpose, and they need a lot of top-down control to make happen. They aren't like roads, where you can run a private bus service, ride a bike, or hop in a car and go.