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Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

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Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#191

Post by atyppo »

cyclecount wrote: post #178
atyppo wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NY prioritizes this stuff in a way that’s great for optics but is wasteful, ineffective, and at a snail’s pace in practice. Construction costs for subways, for example, are about $3.5B/mile [1] as of the most recent line built. Corruption is rampant in unions, contracts, and consultants. The unions are nice enough to demand positions like break room supervisor or elevator operator (to press buttons in an elevator), t…

NY built this bike system in about 10 years: https://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/downloads/pdf/nyc-bike-map-2022... . It's pretty impressive and works well. But yes, the Subway is criminally underfunded (it's ran by the State of NY actually). Nonetheless, despite how bad NY is, it's still the best in the US.

Yep, hence my usage of NY when referring to the MTA. With regard to the bike network in NYC, many of these are vanity projects. Many of the “protected” crosstown bike lanes in Midtown for example, have about 4 feet of room. If someone in a car decides to fling their door open, you don’t have many options to avoid it. Many of the other bike lanes are not usable in substantial parts, such as Schermerhorn St in Brooklyn due to rampant illegal parking. All this is to say that NYC DOT is after a number measured by the number of miles of bike lane, not by cyclist safety. The only “Amsterdam style” bike lane we really, truly have in Manhattan is along the rivers which is way beyond overcrowded on weekends.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#192

Post by ndsipa_pomu »

LeanderK wrote: post #179
ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a cyclist, I don't have an issue sharing space with other traffic, but I do have an issue with the hyper-aggressive drivers that seek to scare and/or injure cyclists by not giving them enough space when overtaking. There's also the abusive drivers that shout at you and beep their horn at you if they disagree with any choices that you've made such as which road to use. Drivers and riders are hardly comparable in te…

> As a cyclist, I don't have an issue sharing space with other traffic, but I do have an issue with the hyper-aggressive drivers that seek to scare and/or injure cyclists by not giving them enough space when overtaking I haven't generally seen that in Germany, although I have only lived in cities with a generally good biking infrastructure. The only time when I get uncomfortably close is either due to fundamental inf…

I'm in the UK and it's very noticeable how much nicer the German drivers have been when I've gone there (just Munich and Berlin). Most surprising was when drivers were wanting to pull out of a side street, but waited patiently for cyclists to go past without any hint of impatience or anger.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#193

Post by Macha »

Glawen wrote: post #143
ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a cyclist, I don't have an issue sharing space with other traffic, but I do have an issue with the hyper-aggressive drivers that seek to scare and/or injure cyclists by not giving them enough space when overtaking. There's also the abusive drivers that shout at you and beep their horn at you if they disagree with any choices that you've made such as which road to use. Drivers and riders are hardly comparable in te…

As a cyclist in a town with a lot of cyclist, I see less aggressive behaviour in my town, than in the countryside where people are not used to cyclist. I was discussing with a fellow cyclist and we agreed that some countryside places were particularly full of aggressive drivers. The more cyclist you have, the less aggressive it becomes

I spent a few months down in the country last year, and definitely encountered this. Drivers don't know how to react, so you tend to get reactions from given massive amounts of space (not that I'm complaining) to passing at breakneck speed.

Though there's other sides to it too, like the local youths who apparently find cycling inherently amusing and worth an attempt to intentionally run me off the road. It happens in other places too, there was an actual conviction last year because someone got recorded doing it at motorway speeds. I also learned last year that "rolling coal" or intentionally annoying cyclists with truck emissions is something in some parts of the US too.

On the plus side though, you can leave a bike just leaning against the outside of the store safely though, while an inadequate lock is grounds for getting your bike stolen in the city. I guess it's due to the lack of anonymity and places to sell stolen bikes out there. You will need to though, as there's nothing to lock the bike to outside the country store.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#194

Post by ndsipa_pomu »

goodpoint wrote: post #170
ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be lovely to see parked cars disappear if autonomous cars become common enough. However, that would also rely on people deciding against car ownership and moving over to a shared vehicle model.

> against car ownership and moving over to a shared vehicle model. We already invented this: public transportation.

The problem is when public transport doesn't match with the people's requirements.

If I were made world leader, I'd subsidise public transport so that it's more or less free to use for the public in an attempt to wean them away from private cars. It would then make sense to expand the network as more and more people choose to use it.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#195

Post by ghaff »

LeanderK wrote: post #185
ghaff wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Why are they always ignored in these threads? Is this an American thing? I don't know but Vespa-type scooters are very uncommon in the US. Motorcycles are less rare but are widely considered (with some justification) to be dangerous as a form of transportation. (It doesn't help that there are some crazy motorcyclists out there though of course many aren't.) May have something to do with the type of road infrastructu…

> I don't know but Vespa-type scooters are very uncommon in the US why? They are also quite common in germany for people living in the city and very useful to get around in the city. I personally bike but I see the appeal.

No idea about the why. Vespas were a bit of thing maybe 20 years or so ago in the US but, while I think I know one person who owns something along those lines, they just aren't very common in my experience. (Maybe because car ownership is higher and it tends to be either/or?)

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#196

Post by Jedd »

sgt wrote: post #180
Hanschri wrote: post #98

Bergen municipality released a 25 minute video[0] of the bike ride through the tunnel and into the downtown area of Bergen. If 'sakte TV' or slow TV is something you like, I could also recommend checking out The Bergen Line minute by minute[1], which is a seven hour broadcast of the train going between Bergen and Oslo. A peaceful and beautiful train ride. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42q15E2YE8Y [1]: https://…

Imagine if there was a cycling culture like this in the South. Places like Chattanooga with skinny cyclists all over the place.

> ... in the South.

Well, most of Europe is south of Norway, and there's a lot of comparable cycling culture and facilities there.

Unless you mean south of the equator, like here in Australia, but unfortunately we're not so good with that. I can't speak to much of the rest of the south (of the equator) unfortunately.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#197

Post by artjumble »

Hanschri wrote: post #98

Bergen municipality released a 25 minute video[0] of the bike ride through the tunnel and into the downtown area of Bergen. If 'sakte TV' or slow TV is something you like, I could also recommend checking out The Bergen Line minute by minute[1], which is a seven hour broadcast of the train going between Bergen and Oslo. A peaceful and beautiful train ride. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42q15E2YE8Y [1]: https://…

A great channel with tons of the Bergen-Oslo train route is RailCowGirl. https://www.youtube.com/@RailCowGirl

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#198

Post by arethuza »

ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #100
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's also the abusive drivers that shout at you and beep their horn at you Yep, happened to me. Also there is a 'compulsive overtaking syndrome' where a driver feels they must overtake the bicycle even if you are exceeding the speed limit on your bicycle. Even if there is not enough space.

The technical term for that is MGIF (Must Get In Front). It's especially bizarre when there's queueing traffic just ahead, so they overtake and then you almost immediately filter past them. It seems as though they're not able to look ahead and anticipate their own progress.

The absolute worst are drivers who do the MGIF thing then immediately do a left turn right in front of you!

Edit: Slight correction - the absolute worst were the kids who thought it would be amusing to throw a brick at me while I was commuting by bike through the outskirts of Edinburgh. Fortunately their aim wasn't very good.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#199

Post by jtr1 »

wunderland wrote: post #184
jtr1 wrote: post #177

What sort of civil society groups are there advocating for this kind of infrastructure in Norway? I’m always curious how people organize to achieve these outcomes. I live in a medium sized city in the US that is badly in need of better cycling infrastructure. There are a few organizations here, but vision is lacking or has been beaten out of them. I’d love to have some sort of organizing / policy toolkit that factors…

The civil society groups and local governments that advocate for this sort of thing exist in the US too. What Norway doesn't have (and much of Europe) is a powerful auto lobby that has prevented this sort of infrastructure for decades and forced cities to be built in giant suburban sprawls.

I’m well aware those groups. I’m asking about solutions here.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#200

Post by arethuza »

wartijn_ wrote: post #105
DeathArrow wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So there are places in Europe where it rains more than in UK?

Yes. Iceland, Norway, Switzerland and Albania. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_average_a...

That's averages over the whole countries though - the north and west of the UK (particularly the Scottish Highlands and the Lake District) are a lot wetter than the south-east where London is.

Also, "volume of rain" might be misleading because it doesn't give you a feeling for how often it rains. The Highlands in particular can have a light rain that falls for weeks at a time (or at least seems like it if you are in a tent).

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