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Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

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Re: Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

#31

Post by doikor »

sokoloff wrote: post #24
shortrounddev wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 5 years Because Apple will forcibly kill it after that with incompatible software updates. Windows machines keep going until they physically break. But what everyone here is missing is that the consumer desktop/laptop market is dying itself. Soon it will only be for enterprise uses and gaming. Most people do all their computing through a phone or tablet. I know people who don't own a laptop.

> Windows machines keep going until they physically break. That's interesting, as I just this month replaced the two kids' Dell 9020s with new PCs because the 9020s didn't support TPM 2.0, required by Windows 11. https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/enable-tpm-2-0-o... "Most PCs that have shipped in the last 5 years are capable of running Trusted Platform Module version 2.0 (TPM 2.0). TPM 2.0 is required to ru…

You still would have had ~3 years left before windows 10 goes EoL (consumer version)

Re: Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

#32

Post by IceHegel »

itsoktocry wrote: post #12
0zemp2c wrote: post #2

hard to feel sorry for Intel here they're still tied to Windows which is increasingly weaker and more rotted over time, losing market share every year for a decade (Microsoft doesn't even seem to care afaict) the Apple M1 laptop is an incredible value, offers 10x the performance the average person will need, with good battery life, a better OS/ecosystem...and its priced right! Intel needs to seriously look at Linux..…

> losing market share every year for a decade (Microsoft doesn't even seem to care afaict) Of course they care. Windows, at one point, had 95% market share. Do you believe that to be sustainable? Do we want that? No, in both cases. They are still dominant in desktop computing. > offers 10x the performance the average person will need Why is buying something 10x more powerful than you'd need at 2x the price "good valu…

If they cared there wouldn’t be tabloid news in everything spare panel.

Re: Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

#33

Post by damagednoob »

itsoktocry wrote: post #12
0zemp2c wrote: post #2

hard to feel sorry for Intel here they're still tied to Windows which is increasingly weaker and more rotted over time, losing market share every year for a decade (Microsoft doesn't even seem to care afaict) the Apple M1 laptop is an incredible value, offers 10x the performance the average person will need, with good battery life, a better OS/ecosystem...and its priced right! Intel needs to seriously look at Linux..…

> losing market share every year for a decade (Microsoft doesn't even seem to care afaict) Of course they care. Windows, at one point, had 95% market share. Do you believe that to be sustainable? Do we want that? No, in both cases. They are still dominant in desktop computing. > offers 10x the performance the average person will need Why is buying something 10x more powerful than you'd need at 2x the price "good valu…

> Why is buying something 10x more powerful than you'd need at 2x the price "good value"?

I would argue in the same way that buying an expensive pair of boots that last longer than a cheap pair to be good value.

> You should have a look at Windows' desktop market share and get back to us. They still own the space.

What is the trend line and how much is that space growing by relative to other devices like mobile phones and tablets?

Re: Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

#34

Post by zpeti »

drumhead wrote: post #7

This looks like some big bath accounting by Intel. Getting all the bad news out of the way in what was expected to be a bad year anyway. The next couple of years will be make or break for them, so Im expecting to see some good things coming out of their pipeline.

Stock is up 5% as of posting this, so I think the market already priced in something even worse potentially.

Re: Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

#35

Post by raddan »

shortrounddev wrote: post #17
sokoloff wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can buy an M1 8/256 Air at $800 right now. I'd expect to get 5 years out of it minimum (we're buying one shortly to replace a mid-2013 Air). That's less than $15/month if it gets thrown in a bin in 5 years. It's under $20/mo if we bin it in 3.5 years. https://www.bestbuy.com/site/macbook-air-13-3-laptop-apple-m... I feel like the Chromebook on the lower end is great for a lot of uses/people and the Air is an easi…

> 5 years Because Apple will forcibly kill it after that with incompatible software updates. Windows machines keep going until they physically break. But what everyone here is missing is that the consumer desktop/laptop market is dying itself. Soon it will only be for enterprise uses and gaming. Most people do all their computing through a phone or tablet. I know people who don't own a laptop.

> Because Apple will forcibly kill it after that with incompatible software updates. Windows machines keep going until they physically break.

This is demonstrably false. My wife continues to use my hand-me-down MacBook Air I bought in 2011. It was supported officially by the macOS until the most recent release, so she’s only one OS revision behind. I also recently retired a 2009 Mac Mini that I used 24/7 as a home server, only because the power supply failed. I used the G4 Mac I bought in 1999 as my daily driver (with some upgrades) until 2009.

A decade or more of use is an incredible value, and I’ve done that multiple times with my Macs. Few of my PCs have had a useful life approaching that length of time (the closest was an Atom machine I ran for 7 years).

Re: Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

#36

Post by nullandvoid »

0zemp2c wrote: post #2

hard to feel sorry for Intel here they're still tied to Windows which is increasingly weaker and more rotted over time, losing market share every year for a decade (Microsoft doesn't even seem to care afaict) the Apple M1 laptop is an incredible value, offers 10x the performance the average person will need, with good battery life, a better OS/ecosystem...and its priced right! Intel needs to seriously look at Linux..…

A similar priced mac > windows is ~2x the price, with no upgrade-ability options. I'm not so sure the price is right, it's expensive and they are making good money on it, but I agree does have some un-matchable features such as the battery life.

I work with both windows (with WSL) and mac OS, and there's nothing massively that sells me either way on the base OS, however I really wish tools like raycast existed in windows.

Re: Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

#37

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

shortrounddev wrote: post #17
sokoloff wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can buy an M1 8/256 Air at $800 right now. I'd expect to get 5 years out of it minimum (we're buying one shortly to replace a mid-2013 Air). That's less than $15/month if it gets thrown in a bin in 5 years. It's under $20/mo if we bin it in 3.5 years. https://www.bestbuy.com/site/macbook-air-13-3-laptop-apple-m... I feel like the Chromebook on the lower end is great for a lot of uses/people and the Air is an easi…

> 5 years Because Apple will forcibly kill it after that with incompatible software updates. Windows machines keep going until they physically break. But what everyone here is missing is that the consumer desktop/laptop market is dying itself. Soon it will only be for enterprise uses and gaming. Most people do all their computing through a phone or tablet. I know people who don't own a laptop.

> Because Apple will forcibly kill it after that with incompatible software updates.

Um, I have a 2012 MacBook Air (11"), that I use for my low-end testing, and as a Zoom host. Works fine. Runs lots of software.

It has to run Catalina (Mac OS 10.15), but Apple still pushes out security patches to it (I think we're up to 10.15.7).

Re: Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

#38

Post by raverbashing »

itsoktocry wrote: post #12
0zemp2c wrote: post #2

hard to feel sorry for Intel here they're still tied to Windows which is increasingly weaker and more rotted over time, losing market share every year for a decade (Microsoft doesn't even seem to care afaict) the Apple M1 laptop is an incredible value, offers 10x the performance the average person will need, with good battery life, a better OS/ecosystem...and its priced right! Intel needs to seriously look at Linux..…

> losing market share every year for a decade (Microsoft doesn't even seem to care afaict) Of course they care. Windows, at one point, had 95% market share. Do you believe that to be sustainable? Do we want that? No, in both cases. They are still dominant in desktop computing. > offers 10x the performance the average person will need Why is buying something 10x more powerful than you'd need at 2x the price "good valu…

> You should have a look at Windows' desktop market share and get back to us. They still own the space.

Ah yes the dwindling, profit starved desktop market

Yes they're still at a high percentage, of an ever smaller market

Not going the way of the vinyl record yet, but who knows?

Re: Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

#39

Post by JKCalhoun »

shortrounddev wrote: post #17
sokoloff wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can buy an M1 8/256 Air at $800 right now. I'd expect to get 5 years out of it minimum (we're buying one shortly to replace a mid-2013 Air). That's less than $15/month if it gets thrown in a bin in 5 years. It's under $20/mo if we bin it in 3.5 years. https://www.bestbuy.com/site/macbook-air-13-3-laptop-apple-m... I feel like the Chromebook on the lower end is great for a lot of uses/people and the Air is an easi…

> 5 years Because Apple will forcibly kill it after that with incompatible software updates. Windows machines keep going until they physically break. But what everyone here is missing is that the consumer desktop/laptop market is dying itself. Soon it will only be for enterprise uses and gaming. Most people do all their computing through a phone or tablet. I know people who don't own a laptop.

I'm not sure "forcibly kill" is the adjective/verb I would have used. I have plenty of older Macs still running older versions of Mac OS. In some ways I kind of prefer them (because I still like the older Mac OSes).

Maybe this is more of an indictment rather than a defense of Apple, but one machine I keep on an OS that's over 5 years old because it has the one version of Apple's Photos that didn't yet screw up the retouch tool. (And I use that tool exhaustively in retouching old family photos I scan in.)

Re: Intel posts largest loss in its history as sales plunge

#40

Post by sokoloff »

Eisenstein wrote: post #30
sokoloff wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Windows machines keep going until they physically break. That's interesting, as I just this month replaced the two kids' Dell 9020s with new PCs because the 9020s didn't support TPM 2.0, required by Windows 11. https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/enable-tpm-2-0-o... "Most PCs that have shipped in the last 5 years are capable of running Trusted Platform Module version 2.0 (TPM 2.0). TPM 2.0 is required to ru…

I'm curious why you felt you needed to upgrade. To my knowledge Windows 11 doesn't do anything that Windows 10 cannot, except for support Intel e cores.

They wanted to play Valorant with their friends; the anti-cheat code did not work on the 9020 on Windows 10; there was a limited amount of time I was willing to spend to find a cheaper workaround for a machine that’s 9 years old, with the prospect of doing the same again 6 months later.

That was the actual driver, though this thread is about OS vendors forcing changes in order to run the latest OS, which is why I focused on the Win11 TPM2 requirements and mentioned the 9 year old Air running a still-patched Catalina.

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