Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

reasonstobecheerful.world

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 250 posts

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#101

Post by wouldbecouldbe »

eythian wrote: post #80
wouldbecouldbe wrote: post #26

In Amsterdam a bridge over the water connecting Central Amsterdam with the North is always a hot topic, for decades of talking about it sill hasn't materialized. A few serious alternatives that were proposed where tunnels for bikes. But they consistently decide not to do it because of safety concerns at night. Which is hopefully a bigger issue in Amsterdam than Bergen.

I saw something in the news today that the gemeente has earmarked €100m for the bridge, 1/3rd of the total (another 100m coming from another source, and the remaining to be raised.) Bike tunnels under the IJ apparently (so I recall reading, anyway) also have the issue that to have not too steep slopes at the end, the entry/exit points will have to be a reasonable distance from the water itself. https://nltimes.nl/202…

Yeah the steepness is also a problem, few designs proposed had a spiral down from the station, looked pretty cool. Others had a sort of bike lift, and indeed others made it start between Dam square and Central station.

Btw bridge also deal with steepness issues, since they have to be pretty high, and in most cases also have to be able to open.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#102

Post by mkoubaa »

CrampusDestrus wrote: post #8

The best thing about pedestrian/cycling bridges and tunnels is that they cost soooo much less money to build since they have so much laxer requirements. The reason why we still have roman bridges standing is because the stress contribution of a human walking on it is basically zero. But start bringing in cars and trucks and see it crumble in a week

Not sure about structurally but in terms of ventilation I think this is right

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#103

Post by ubercore »

cjrp wrote: post #3
biomene wrote: post #2

It's the escape tunnel for a tram tunnel with an extra coat of paint: https://www.lifeinnorway.net/bergen-cycle-tunnel/

> It will cost an additional NOK 500 million to upgrade the tunnel from an emergency service to one that can be used daily. $46M USD, to save cyclists 5.5km/20 minutes; that seems like a pretty good return.

And avoid 20 minutes of getting soaked in Bergen, also a plus.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#104

Post by CalRobert »

lm28469 wrote: post #64
CalRobert wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a Notjustbikes superfan and love my bike, but container ships are a marvel of efficiency and emissions per kg per km are probably better for the ship. cyclist: 21g CO2 per km lifecycle - https://ecf.com/news-and-events/news/how-much-co2-does-cycli... Say I can manage 100kg on a cargo bike, that puts us at 210mg CO2 per km per kg. Container ship: 16g CO2 per tonne per km - https://8billiontrees.com/carbon-offsets-…

I feel like the greatest trick they recently played on us is to focus everything on CO2... CO2 is but a small part of the equation, container ships release other nasty things. Even for cars co2 isn't the main issue, particulates from tires and brakes will fuck you up faster than any amount of co2 > The two main pollutants from a ship’s emissions are Nitrogen Oxides (NOx) and Sulphur Oxides (SOx). These gases have adv…

I generally agree but it was an interesting thought experiment nonetheless.

And particulates are nasty stuff, especially considering that it's not like they tend to be biodegradable.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#105

Post by wartijn_ »

DeathArrow wrote: post #71
MagnumOpus wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People might use cars or public transport instead of a bike to commute if there is heavy rain or snow. This is an important consideration in Bergen which is notoriously the rainiest city in Europe (it rains more than half the time).

So there are places in Europe where it rains more than in UK?

Yes. Iceland, Norway, Switzerland and Albania.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_average_a...

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#106

Post by goodpoint »

sweettea wrote: post #5
cjrp wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It will cost an additional NOK 500 million to upgrade the tunnel from an emergency service to one that can be used daily. $46M USD, to save cyclists 5.5km/20 minutes; that seems like a pretty good return.

Indeed, if we assume cyclists use the tunnel 100 days a year going both ways through it, thats saving each one nearly 60+ hours a year. If each one's time is worth $20, that is over a thousand dollars per cyclist per year - it only takes 9k cyclists to make the savings outweigh the costs in five years.

Plus the health benefits of cycling and the ones of not being involved in driving accidents.

Plus the saving in car TCO and fuel, plus less road maintenance.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#107

Post by CalRobert »

short_sells_poo wrote: post #29
CalRobert wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a Notjustbikes superfan and love my bike, but container ships are a marvel of efficiency and emissions per kg per km are probably better for the ship. cyclist: 21g CO2 per km lifecycle - https://ecf.com/news-and-events/news/how-much-co2-does-cycli... Say I can manage 100kg on a cargo bike, that puts us at 210mg CO2 per km per kg. Container ship: 16g CO2 per tonne per km - https://8billiontrees.com/carbon-offsets-…

Imagine a cyclist who exists on a diet of beans, beer and dairy. Perhaps slightly lower CO2 emissions but vastly more methane and various mercaptans :D

Would want to replace the dairy with someone without an animal origin ideally. And pyroflatulence could be an aid to reducing methane emissions.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#108

Post by earthnail »

ghaff wrote: post #93
INTPenis wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure but again, just like packing people onto a bridge like sardines, it's an unusual circumstance. While vehicles driving all day over a bridge is not unusual. And even vehicles getting stuck on a bridge due to some traffic issue is not unusual either. One has to consider what is daily use, not just the exceptional cases.

I'm not sure I understand that comment. "Well, yeah, the bridge collapsed but it was an exceptional case. It worked fine for typical daily use."

Here is how I understand the comment:

We have a car bridge designed to withstand exceptional load, and a pedestrian bridge designed to withstand exceptional load. The commenter assumes that on average, the car bridge's load is much closer to it's maximum load than the pedestrian bridge's load, and in consequence, the average wear on the car bridge should be higher than on the pedestrian bridge. As such, the pedestrian bridge should have a much longer lifetime, and the commenter assumes that this is the reason old Roman bridges are still standing.

Their question is: is this assumption correct?

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#109

Post by wouldbecouldbe »

eythian wrote: post #80
wouldbecouldbe wrote: post #26

In Amsterdam a bridge over the water connecting Central Amsterdam with the North is always a hot topic, for decades of talking about it sill hasn't materialized. A few serious alternatives that were proposed where tunnels for bikes. But they consistently decide not to do it because of safety concerns at night. Which is hopefully a bigger issue in Amsterdam than Bergen.

I saw something in the news today that the gemeente has earmarked €100m for the bridge, 1/3rd of the total (another 100m coming from another source, and the remaining to be raised.) Bike tunnels under the IJ apparently (so I recall reading, anyway) also have the issue that to have not too steep slopes at the end, the entry/exit points will have to be a reasonable distance from the water itself. https://nltimes.nl/202…

Haha but yeah they always have some sort of plan. Not long ago, maybe 5 years ago, a bicycle bridge was pretty close, I created the site where the people living could vote on different options of the bridge, but they also needed approvement from the national governemnt because it affects the water way and they didn't approve: https://www.at5.nl/artikelen/207386/javabrug-definitief-van-...

It wasn't the best plan anyway, was too far from CS close to Pakhuis de Zwager.

But the new plan is even more ridiculous, they want to create it at Azartplein now.

But keeps happening. Too many stakeholders, and lack of urgency.

Re: Europe’s Longest Bicycling Tunnel Opens in Norway

#110

Post by ubercore »

DeathArrow wrote: post #71
MagnumOpus wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People might use cars or public transport instead of a bike to commute if there is heavy rain or snow. This is an important consideration in Bergen which is notoriously the rainiest city in Europe (it rains more than half the time).

So there are places in Europe where it rains more than in UK?

Welcome to western Norway. Bring a raincoat!
Post reply on HN