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Commercial lunar lander presumed lost after moon landing attempt

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Re: Commercial lunar lander presumed lost after moon landing attempt

#91

Post by renewiltord »

pc86 wrote: post #39
TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why I do not understand people who would jump at the chance to live on a permanent Martian or Lunar colony.

Because everyone assumes they'd be an explorer or visionary scientist when they'd most likely just be taking out the trash in a frozen desert.

I don't think non-explorers really understand explorers. There were other people on Captain Cook's voyage and other people on Columbus's. Taking a shot at long odds is about knowing that you may fail.

Lorisks want certainty and knowledge that they may not fail.

Hirisks hope for uncertainty and the chance that they may succeed wildly.

It is built in to a Hirisk's belief system that they may fail. But while a Lorisk might find it cringy to try and fail, a Hirisk won't.

You won't really get it if you're not a Hirisk because you think "well what if I end up taking out the trash in a frozen desert" and they think "well what if I actually find or do something amazing".

Sometimes you end up proving H. pylori or inventing cardiac catheterization and other times you go down in history as the guy who thought he invented the parachute and learned otherwise on the way down from the Eiffel Tower or worse, you don't go down in history at all.

Re: Commercial lunar lander presumed lost after moon landing attempt

#92

Post by samtho »

heavyset_go wrote: post #86
golergka wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the things that have improved the human race have been done commercially, and those motivated by profit have done a hundredfold more for humanity than those who were motivated by idealism.

Weird considering idealism got us things like free insulin[1] when none existed, Linux, important things like human rights, democracy etc. [1] https://www.vox.com/2019/4/3/18293950/why-is-insulin-so-expe...

What if I told you that both can be true at the same time? A free market is one of the only vehicles that has allowed people to be lifted out of poverty, self determination and the freedom to decide one’s own destiny is a very profound idea that we take for granted when talking about different forms of governance that are fundamentally incompatible with that. On the other hand, we need a balance of power for the benefit and health of a society. Social safety nets, publicly beneficial infrastructure, and sensible regulations must exist, not in spite of, but to complement and protect the freedom we enjoy.

Re: Commercial lunar lander presumed lost after moon landing attempt

#93

Post by twelve40 »

beders wrote: post #10

It was heartbreaking to see the control room during the first few minutes after the landing. Imagine a project you've worked on for years going kaput and you won't even know why. None of these engineers will find sleep tonight. I hope some moon orbiter can take pics of the landing site soon.

[flagged]

Re: Commercial lunar lander presumed lost after moon landing attempt

#94

Post by xwolfi »

danielodievich wrote: post #72

I am currently reading the gorgeous Folio Society edition of the A Man on the Moon The Voyages of the Apollo Astronauts by Andrew Chaikin (worth a buy from https://www.foliosociety.com/usa/a-man-on-the-moon.html if you a) like the topic and b) have 235.00). I just finished the book 1 which ends with well known Apollo 13 disaster and the RCA of the explosion is that the liquid O2 tank for the fuel cell was intended fo…

Space is hard and they had not even left the Earth.

Re: Commercial lunar lander presumed lost after moon landing attempt

#95

Post by xwolfi »

tomxor wrote: post #83
et-al wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a visual illusion dependent on the focal length of the lens being used and any foreground objects that are on the studio backlot .

Yup, even in person i.e without zooming, the moon looks way smaller when in the middle of the sky; yet on the horizon amongst man made structures it can look bigger... measure it with your thumb and it's the same size - context changes our perception.

We dont see reality, we see what our brains need to focus on to eat another day.

Re: Commercial lunar lander presumed lost after moon landing attempt

#96

Post by twelve40 »

LuckySalamander wrote: post #85
speedgoose wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Foot pound second is such a weird unit. How did that pass the quality controls? I also don’t understand how one team of educated engineers could decide to use imperial units instead of metric units.

Aerospace engineering is still a mix of both units. Especially on the aeronautics side, imperial is still widely used. Part of the reason for this is that past reference materials and tooling at many manufacturers still using imperial tooling. A team of good engineers is expected to be proficient with both unit systems --- its not really a big deal to use imperial on projects.

> its not really a big deal to use imperial on projects

but it does look pretty embarassing when it destroys a project

Re: Commercial lunar lander presumed lost after moon landing attempt

#97

Post by rad_gruchalski »

TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #36
mostlysimilar wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obligatory Sagan quote: > Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, ev…

This is why I do not understand people who would jump at the chance to live on a permanent Martian or Lunar colony.

We can’t stay here forever. This planet is 4.5 billion years old and has 1 billion years left. That’s assuming that our species will be able to survive so long.

Re: Commercial lunar lander presumed lost after moon landing attempt

#99

Post by nradov »

LuckySalamander wrote: post #81
pc86 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because everyone assumes they'd be an explorer or visionary scientist when they'd most likely just be taking out the trash in a frozen desert.

The closest experience to what living in space that can be experienced on earth is living on a submarine. Working with advanced tech in an environment where everything is trying to kill you, logistics challenges to maintain operation, schedule completely dictated for you, etc. But ask many people who want to live on Mars if they would go on a long underway on a submarine, and they don't seem to excited by the idea. I…

It's kind of a moot issue anyway. I hope that a few human explorers will visit the Moon and Mars in the coming decades (and there will be no shortage of volunteers), but the notion of sending settlers there in our lifetimes is a total fantasy. Even if orbital launch costs come way down, the cost of protecting settlers (i.e. at least several dozen permanent inhabitants) from radiation exposure and toxic dust will be so high that no government or corporation could afford it.

Re: Commercial lunar lander presumed lost after moon landing attempt

#100

Post by xwolfi »

shagie wrote: post #42
TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why I do not understand people who would jump at the chance to live on a permanent Martian or Lunar colony.

I would direct you to another Sagan quote as part of Wanderers - a short film by Erik Wernquist : https://vimeo.com/108650530 For all its material advantages, the sedentary life has left us edgy, unfulfilled. Even after 400 generations in villages and cities, we haven’t forgotten. The open road still softly calls, like a nearly forgotten song of childhood. We invest far-off places with a certain romance. This appeal,…

You can scratch this itch by emigrating: I left Normandy for Hong Kong 8 years ago, and it still feels like I'm living on Mars lol

It's true that nothing beats the feeling of being lost, rebuilding a nest elsewhere, to have people around you who cant possibly understand you unless you spend large effort studying their ways and speech, the constant underlying fear it can all end tomorrow kicking your ass into giving your maximum everyday.

If you cant go to Mars, move to a Chinese city, it's the next best thing.

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