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Animal meat and milk sales drop in Europe as vegan versions hit record highs

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Re: Animal meat and milk sales drop in Europe as vegan versions hit record highs

#11

Post by jiggywiggy »

deepsun wrote: post #6
mvdwoord wrote: post #4

Plenty to improve in food production, sure, but the current move towards hyper processed foods is dumb. They can take the animal meat (and eggs, and dairy products) from my cold dead hands..

Relax, no one is really considering meat foods to go away in the next 100 years or so. It's all about the access to the vegetarian and vegan foods to those who want it, and it happens to become more popular, so market adapts. But you present it like someone tries to take your food.

Maybe not with you. But in most modern cities they are actively campaigning against meat, they are mostly using the moral card: you are destroying the planet. How fun.

Re: Animal meat and milk sales drop in Europe as vegan versions hit record highs

#12

Post by kfk »

I am getting a bit deeper into the food industry since I started investing in a startup that plans to produce animal feed with insects. Animal feeds are prepared with specific properties, for instance, fish feed at 60% protein. The impact of different percentages of compounds is measured closely on animal well being, growth, weight… I am quite bothered that we don’t do the same for human foods. We lighlty compare real milk with plant based milk without being honest about the completely different properties of the two. I suspect the difficult conversation we need to be having would be about proteins and how to produce them sustainabily and ethically. Many plant based vegan alternatives hide from the real problem, I think.

Re: Animal meat and milk sales drop in Europe as vegan versions hit record highs

#13

Post by mg »

Vegans of HN: What do you supplement and why?

Personally, I supplement VitaminD3 and Iron.

And I make sure to eat salad, carrots and avocado every day.

I came up with this regime after getting my blood work done and after exactly tracking all my nutritional values for a while and comparing those to the suggested amounts.

I also have a long running project in the "statistics of one" space, where I track a lot of treatment effect correlations:

https://www.gibney.org/a_syntax_for_self-tracking

27,899 entries in my log so far.

From all supplements I a/b tested, Vitamin D3 and Iron look most promising at the moment.

Re: Animal meat and milk sales drop in Europe as vegan versions hit record highs

#14

Post by nasmorn »

mvdwoord wrote: post #4

Plenty to improve in food production, sure, but the current move towards hyper processed foods is dumb. They can take the animal meat (and eggs, and dairy products) from my cold dead hands..

If you don’t buy them from very traditional read very expensive producers it is also very unnatural. Animals are simply used as self replacing bio reactors that are fed the cheapest inputs like grain and animal remains. Even the vitamin d in milk is mostly there because you just supplement the animals. I visit a small farm on vacation a few times a year and they have a bunch of chicken running around. I have no qualms eating their eggs, they are not even slaughtered in most cases as the fox eats them first. They also have a dozen cows on their meadow. But let’s not pretend that is where most animal products come from.

Re: Animal meat and milk sales drop in Europe as vegan versions hit record highs

#16

Post by jiggywiggy »

mg wrote: post #13

Vegans of HN: What do you supplement and why? Personally, I supplement VitaminD3 and Iron. And I make sure to eat salad, carrots and avocado every day. I came up with this regime after getting my blood work done and after exactly tracking all my nutritional values for a while and comparing those to the suggested amounts. I also have a long running project in the "statistics of one" space, where I track a lot of treat…

Please also check you b vitamins and B12. They are very hard to get and had some friends being defficient without knowing it. Most of the plant based fake meats put it in, so that saves most people. But they were health oriented and also didn't eat those.

Re: Animal meat and milk sales drop in Europe as vegan versions hit record highs

#17

Post by karmakurtisaani »

kfk wrote: post #12

I am getting a bit deeper into the food industry since I started investing in a startup that plans to produce animal feed with insects. Animal feeds are prepared with specific properties, for instance, fish feed at 60% protein. The impact of different percentages of compounds is measured closely on animal well being, growth, weight… I am quite bothered that we don’t do the same for human foods. We lighlty compare rea…

It's funny you are worried about the impact of vegan alternatives and not, say, sugars, alcohol, overly fatty or salty foods, too much bad quality meat raised with hormones etc. It's almost like you have a bias against the vegan alternative..

Edit: ok so I was not terribly constructive with this comment, so happy to elaborate. I'm pretty tired of this argument against vegan meat. The nutritional values of vegan meat are not that bad even in the worst case in relation to everything else that is in the market - it's a non issue at best. What I believe the commenters parroting this line really want to say is that they like meat and need a reason not to eat/support the alternatives.

Arguments against eating meat are orders of magnitude heavier than against vegan meat.

Re: Animal meat and milk sales drop in Europe as vegan versions hit record highs

#18

Post by redprince »

epilys wrote: post #3

Animal milk outside of not being ethically sourced, could really be a better product if it came lactose free and fortified with Vitamin D by default.

As someone who actually enjoys the taste of milk and does not consider it a white liquid of unimportant taste to be poured over or into something other: No. Lactose free milk certainly hasn't the better taste and isn't the better product except for the lactose intolerant.

Re: Animal meat and milk sales drop in Europe as vegan versions hit record highs

#19

Post by bwb »

jiggywiggy wrote: post #11
deepsun wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Relax, no one is really considering meat foods to go away in the next 100 years or so. It's all about the access to the vegetarian and vegan foods to those who want it, and it happens to become more popular, so market adapts. But you present it like someone tries to take your food.

Maybe not with you. But in most modern cities they are actively campaigning against meat, they are mostly using the moral card: you are destroying the planet. How fun.

It isn't a 0 or 1, prob good for you health wise and for the planet to eat a little less meat and a bit more veg. Just look at the data out there.

This last year I am really decreasing how much meat I eat (ill never give it up although I am excited about ground cricket meat and trying that). I am doing it for my health, costs, and because its good for the planet long term.

Re: Animal meat and milk sales drop in Europe as vegan versions hit record highs

#20

Post by capableweb »

licebmi__at__ wrote: post #15

Weird anecdote, in my circle, everyone hates vegan “meat” yet everybody is also reducing meat consumption.

I don't think it's super weird. I'm lowering my meat consumption by eating more non-meat, and I'm not particularly interested in things that try to fake being meat, when I do eat I prefer meat, not something pretending to be meat. Lots of vegan friends in my circle also complains about companies doing fake meat instead of doing better products not trying to imitate meat.
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