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The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

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Re: The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

#111

Post by JohnFen »

pksebben wrote: post #87
hammyhavoc wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, clothes are mostly down to weather and laws on public decency, and nudists are the counterpoint that prove some demographics would prefer to be naked if the law allowed it, same with tribes like Koma. Locks are more for security than privacy, and it's important not to conflate the two. People can have nothing to hide, but also not want to be robbed. And as for email, that's again a matter of security because th…

In an information environment, security and privacy are the same thing. The terms may have different connotations culturally, but good security-in-depth is the same set of practices that enable digital privacy, because the objective is the same: prevent leakage of facts.

> In an information environment, security and privacy are the same thing

Yes. Privacy is a subset of security.

Re: The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

#112

Post by mattnewton »

throwaway5959 wrote: post #28
tomschlick wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do Californians keep re-electing her?

Why do Kentuckians keep re-electing Mitch McConnell?

That makes more sense to me than Feinstein really. He looks after wealthy Kentucky interests, and is a very powerful senator shaping policy for the whole Republican Party; Feinstein seems unaware of Silicon Valley’s interests and basically votes along party lines.

Re: The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

#113

Post by hermannj314 »

Alupis wrote: post #101
pc86 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even among the dinosaurs in the US Senate, Feinstein stands alone in her striking ability to be willfully ignorant about anything developed after the steam locomotive. The country would be an objectively better place if both the House and Senate had a mandatory retirement age.

Why do these people continue to be re-elected at all? Surely there's some other (D) that could have replaced Feinstein a decade ago - but California keeps re-electing her? There's near unanimous agreement she "lost it" long ago - yet here she still is. A mandatory retirement age is great and all... but maybe we need to figure out why people vote for someone nearly nobody wants in the first place. Just the "safe" vote…

Senators get OP with longevity. Having a bunch of old senators is an emergent behavior of the rules of the Senate.

Re: The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

#114

Post by JohnFen »

pksebben wrote: post #92
notRobot wrote: post #3

I'm so tired. I wish we didn't have to keep going through constant attacks on our privacy. I know they're hoping that people will give up after a point out of weariness, and I'm afraid when it comes to many people they're right.

I feel like we just have to hold out for another couple of decades - until there aren't any boomers left in government. This whole clusterfuck is a result of old people not knowing their ass from a pihole.

If history is any guide, the people who will replace the boomers will not be any different. The root cause is not related to age or generation, it's related to power.

Re: The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

#115

Post by Alupis »

hermannj314 wrote: post #113
Alupis wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do these people continue to be re-elected at all? Surely there's some other (D) that could have replaced Feinstein a decade ago - but California keeps re-electing her? There's near unanimous agreement she "lost it" long ago - yet here she still is. A mandatory retirement age is great and all... but maybe we need to figure out why people vote for someone nearly nobody wants in the first place. Just the "safe" vote…

Senators get OP with longevity. Having a bunch of old senators is an emergent behavior of the rules of the Senate.

I don't personally think age is really the problem - mental (and to some extent, physical) abilities are, however.

There's the good 80 years old, and then there's the bad 80 years old. We all know it when we see it... and we're watching it in real time in multiple places within our federal government right now.

We, as a country, are about to face this very same question again, as President Biden is expected to announce his re-election bid shortly. Are we OK with that as a country, given his obvious decline in the past few years? Objectively, and without red or blue coloring, he's not the Joe Biden of 2008.

So, what do we do?

Re: The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

#116

Post by r3trohack3r »

borski wrote: post #61
dehrmann wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> FEINSTEIN Many years ago, I remember she supported a similar bill around limiting encryption. Around six months later, it was reported some government agency was spying on senators' emails, and she wasn't happy. I don't think she made the connection between the two, or that she supports widespread data collection when it's not her data.

I met her at an SVLG dinner and had a discussion about encryption; it became instantly clear she doesn’t know what a computer is past that it is a TV that takes input, and that encryption is just “evil people wanting to do evil things.” There was no reasoning with her either, frankly because she is well-aged, and thus thinks herself “wise” with very little left to learn. It was honestly infuriating. [edit] In case an…

Everyone should watch these two hearings:

https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/hearings/open-hearing-fi...

https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/hearings/open-hearing-fi...

Feinstein shows her true colors.

The first is 2013, right after Snowden leaked the presidential surveillance program. These are our elected officials who oversaw the program. They knew of its existence before the leak.

The second is 2017, right after the Supreme Court ruled the presidential surveillance program was illegal (one justice calling it "Orwellian" in their comments).

Listen to these people in 2013 defend their actions and, in 2017, try to defend themselves and justify their actions. Not only is it clear that they don't think they've done anything wrong, at least one of these people thought they had a viable chance at running for president after this.

We the people trusted them to keep secrets responsibly. We trusted them to oversee programs that citizens could not hold accountable. They utterly failed and, if they had their way, would have continued failing in their responsibility. From watching these hearings I get the distinct feeling that these elected officials consider the problem to be the leak, not that someone had to utterly ruin their own life in order to expose this group's crimes.

The only person who demonstrated they may be fit for their position is Sn. Wyden. Listen closely to Wyden's statement. He is unable to disclose secrets, but he very clearly (and strongly) suggests that the U.S. clandestine groups are harvesting geolocation data without warrants in mass under these programs.

Re: The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

#117

Post by morkalork »

prottog wrote: post #107
pc86 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even among the dinosaurs in the US Senate, Feinstein stands alone in her striking ability to be willfully ignorant about anything developed after the steam locomotive. The country would be an objectively better place if both the House and Senate had a mandatory retirement age.

I think the reasoning behind not having an age cap in Congress is that if the people want to elect someone who is old, they should be able to do so. The ultimate check in a democratic society is the people, and like a different commenter said, it's strange that the voters of California continue to vote for Feinstein.

Presumably they vote for her because she is a democrat and the other viable candidate, a republican, is completely unpalatable to them. The problem is internal party politics that appear to have an unwritten rule of re-running the same candidate until they lose.

Re: The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

#118

Post by hammyhavoc »

JohnFen wrote: post #108
hammyhavoc wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, clothes are mostly down to weather and laws on public decency, and nudists are the counterpoint that prove some demographics would prefer to be naked if the law allowed it, same with tribes like Koma. Locks are more for security than privacy, and it's important not to conflate the two. People can have nothing to hide, but also not want to be robbed. And as for email, that's again a matter of security because th…

> Well, clothes are mostly down to weather and laws on public decency Where I live, there are no laws against public nudity (as long as the nudity isn't "salacious" in nature). And yet, very nearly 100% of the people are clothed at all times.

And yet in other areas of the world, people wear no clothes.

People also smoke cigarettes, eat junk food, and do things that are unnatural and otherwise detrimental due to what they're bombarded with.

I wear clothes, I'm not a nudist. I have zero shame about my body though, it's a body—we've all got one.

The point as per my other comments: different solutions for different problems, the appropriateness of each varies with demographics. E.g., if you're surviving in an oppressive regime as a dissenter, email is something to be avoided. If you're running a business, it's likely fine, provided that it's compliant for your industry, e.g., HIPAA.

Re: The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

#119

Post by morkalork »

borski wrote: post #98
pc86 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even among the dinosaurs in the US Senate, Feinstein stands alone in her striking ability to be willfully ignorant about anything developed after the steam locomotive. The country would be an objectively better place if both the House and Senate had a mandatory retirement age.

My instinct is to say “no, that’s ageist” because there are plenty of older people who are legitimately brilliant. But honestly, she’s a fantastic example of why we should have term limits, at the very least.

Leave administration to younger, more capable people. The ones who are too old but are brilliant can still be advisors and mentors.

Re: The EARN IT bill is back, seeking to scan our messages and photos

#120

Post by prottog »

RajT88 wrote: post #97
dsfyu404ed wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Party(TM) must love types like you. There's a huge subset (dare I say majority) of those "patriots" you deride who don't like this stuff, don't think their goings on are any of the government's business. But of course you ignore that because they don't want what you want on meaningless social issues.

Real patriots, in my experience: 1. Don't talk long and loud about being patriots (i.e. don't self-identify) 2. Tend to work for the government. Career govvies or military. They show their patriotism through action. > There's a huge subset (dare I say majority) of those "patriots" you deride who don't like this stuff, don't think their goings on are any of the government's business. I know the type well, as that desc…

> Tend to work for the government. Career govvies or military. They show their patriotism through action.

I just want to chime in here and say that working for the government isn't the only way to be a patriot (i.e. serve the country). Upholding American values is something anyone can do in any part of society.

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