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Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

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Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#291

Post by [deleted] »

eloisant wrote: post #281
lostlogin wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is unlike for a doctor, where it's obvious which side is which: you can see the patient. This isn’t always true and it’s not always obvious. For example with imaging - axial slices of the patient through symmetrical structures. The brain, lower abdo, a single leg or arm etc, etc. There are conventions in image display for a reason - it is not obvious. For axial slices, as an observer, you are positioned as tho…

I don't know, when you're talking about "the right arm", it seems obvious that it's the patient's right arm and not the arm that you see on your right when you're looking at the patient. I don't think you need to go to medical school to understand that.

[deleted]

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#292

Post by 4gotunameagain »

MagicMoonlight wrote: post #274
4gotunameagain wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A sailor, looking towards the back of the boat: - There's an incoming boat ! - From where ? - From the left ! Is it the left of the sailor, or is it the left of the vessel ?

You only know which side is port or starboard by figuring out your orientation compared to the ship and picking the left side of the ship. So it’s not actually achieving anything. You could just say left always refers to the ship’s left.

Port and starboard become instinctive very quickly, with no mental gymnastics needed. Left and right are confusing, there must be a reason all sailors are using those terms..

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#293

Post by varjag »

Too bad there are no good substitutes for general use that don't make you sound like a wannabe pirate.

On one of our products (that has symmetric speakers, sensors and lights) we use "proper left" and "proper right" in reference material. The markings are also molded on the chassis. It makes communicating with technicians in the field so much easier.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#294

Post by magicalhippo »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #200
fargle wrote: post #135

When I was a kid in Minnesota we needed to learn port/starboard and the colors red/green. A trick that helped me remember is that "LEFT", "PORT", and "RED" are all the shorter words and "RIGHT", "STARBOARD", and "GREEN" are the longer words in the respective pairs. FWIW.

This would probably throw my girlfriend off. She has some kind of right/left dyslexia. When she's driving and I'm giving directions I have to tell her "short turn" or "long turn". Long turn being left, longer because it's across a lane, right turns are shorter. But if someone told her that left is shorter than right for remembering purposes, it would probably mess her up more when following driving directions.

In our relationship it's me who has that. So she'll tell me "right" and "no, the other right". Or vice versa.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#295

Post by vraid »

MagicMoonlight wrote: post #274
4gotunameagain wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A sailor, looking towards the back of the boat: - There's an incoming boat ! - From where ? - From the left ! Is it the left of the sailor, or is it the left of the vessel ?

You only know which side is port or starboard by figuring out your orientation compared to the ship and picking the left side of the ship. So it’s not actually achieving anything. You could just say left always refers to the ship’s left.

This all feels a bit like arguing against the use of cardinal directions because they don't make sense unless you learn them first.

If you use left and right for the ship, you wouldn't be able to use personal left and right without risking ambiguity. You'd just be trading one convenience for the other.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#296

Post by rprospero »

eloisant wrote: post #281
lostlogin wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is unlike for a doctor, where it's obvious which side is which: you can see the patient. This isn’t always true and it’s not always obvious. For example with imaging - axial slices of the patient through symmetrical structures. The brain, lower abdo, a single leg or arm etc, etc. There are conventions in image display for a reason - it is not obvious. For axial slices, as an observer, you are positioned as tho…

I don't know, when you're talking about "the right arm", it seems obvious that it's the patient's right arm and not the arm that you see on your right when you're looking at the patient. I don't think you need to go to medical school to understand that.

You're right that "the left lung" should obviously be the lung on the patient's left. However, can you look at the image below and immediately identify which is the "left" lung?

https://scratch.rprosperoglobal.duckdns.org/lungs.png

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#297

Post by stephen_g »

serial_dev wrote: post #233

I wish they gave or examples as to why simple left and right would be confusing, and how port and starboard are different and better. Maybe because I'm from a landlocked country, but this article didn't help me understand the why .

It's a bit like theater - left and right are different depending on whether you're looking at the stage (such as from the audience) or looking out from the stage. So you have to have "stage left" and "house left" (and the same for right) to distinguish them. But it's still confusing if somebody just says left. Which left?

So they could just say something like "ship left" and "ship right" that are always referenced to the bow of the ship, and that would work almost as well, but having special terms just removes any possibility for confusion.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#298

Post by mjlee »

walthamstow wrote: post #207
petersellers wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also pretty cool that a ton of sailing vocabulary has made its way into common English vernacular. I guess with the UK being the most powerful country in the world at one time (and projecting their power via their Navy) it's not too surprising.

What are some examples? I am English but I know nothing about the maritime world, so I likely know the words as slang/vernacular terms but not what they mean on a ship.

There are some we use in tech every day. The word log (as in logbook/log file) comes from a literal log that was thrown overboard to estimate the speed of the ship for navigation.

After that, there's some fun slang that's nautical. Chockablock comes from the blocks (pulleys) getting jammed on each other when multiple ropes are being worked on. "Not enough room to swing a cat" refers to the Cat o' Nine Tails which was a whip used for punishment on board ships.

Of course, I'm not even including the influx from containerisation! Helm, tiller, etc. etc.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#299

Post by Macha »

nostromo wrote: post #256
walthamstow wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are some examples? I am English but I know nothing about the maritime world, so I likely know the words as slang/vernacular terms but not what they mean on a ship.

A toilet on a boat is called a head because it was historically placed at the front of the boat. You’ll still hear folks say “hit the head” referring to using the restroom.

Regional usage maybe? Never heard that expression in my life

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#300

Post by drpixie »

nicky0 wrote: post #231
walthamstow wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are some examples? I am English but I know nothing about the maritime world, so I likely know the words as slang/vernacular terms but not what they mean on a ship.

Have a read (or listen to the brilliantly read audiobook) of Master and Commander, and the subsequent series of novels by Patrick O'Brien. Apart from being entertaining historical novels, you learn a lot about naval life and terminology. Reading them I am struck by just how much nautical lingo made its way into common English usage.

And if you like the O'Brien books, read the C.S. Forester "Horatio Hornblower" books - historically & nautically accurate and very readable.
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