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iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

techcrunch.com

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Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#411

Post by ThatPlayer »

Spivak wrote: post #75
1over137 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>today you have the ability to install facebook with app store restrictions on iOS and without on Android You have a third choice: don't install facebook at all.

You see how that's worse right? Either give up your privacy or don't use FB. On iOS you can have both.

You can also do it the same way I use Facebook on my desktop without install an app that gives up my privacy. Open up my browser and type in www dot facebook dot com. You'll get all the privacy protection that Safari on The App Store gives you. I think they even have a PWA now if you really want an icon to make it easier.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#412

Post by onli »

op00to wrote: post #293
josephcsible wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is your argument that because Apple's review process has a lot of false positives, that it must be good? Consider a "review" process that consists of rolling two dice, and rejecting the app if you rolled snake eyes.

no, I did not say that. My intention of referring to the difficulties is that some rigor is required. The play store is a rubber stamp.

The Play Store reviews promises more than a rubber stamp. It's okay to see it as such, but you said above the Play Store doesn't even pretend; If that were the case there would be no review process.

Google will this year address some of the data leaks that are still possible by limiting what apps can do. They introduced the limitations before, now apps will be forced to use the newer API targets that enable them. And that is done via the limitations the Play Store applies to apps (rule based + reviews) and the changed to Android's permission system.

All of that can be criticized in detail, but that they are doing nothing and not even try to project the image that they protect users is just wrong.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#413

Post by twalichiewicz »

It's understandable that people are eager for the potential of side loading on iOS, as it could provide more direct access to apps without the need for intermediaries / App Store policy misunderstandings. However, it's worth considering the potential downsides of this approach, particularly the risk of app and service balkanization. This is already happening in the gaming industry, where major studios force you to use their own launchers to capture valuable (sellable) data about their customers.

But to play the optimist, perhaps inspiration can be taken from how macOS handles app installation from non-App Store sources:

- You go to the developers website

- You are presented with two links if the app is also available on the App Store with the alternative being direct download

- After downloading the .dmg you are presented with a modified version of the Installer.app UI that runs you through what services the app uses, data that it collects, where it will install, additional options, etc.

- One final confirmation of "Is this from a trusted developer"

- Installer.app runs a virus / malware check against what is going to be installed

- App is ready to go on the phone

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#415

Post by dhdhhdd »

jclardy wrote: post #125
TexanFeller wrote: post #10

I'm dreading this. I want privacy hostile companies like Facebook to have to comply with the app store rules and respect system settings relating to privacy. As a user, I'm thrilled when Apple wields its big stick to stop big tech companies from overreaching. Before there was a bit of a compromise, I could use evil apps with some peace of mind that they wouldn't do something egregious. Now I suspect evil apps just wo…

I'm the opposite, as looking at android, where do we see this? All big players are still in the play store, because the average user of those services doesn't want to be bothered going to a website, clicking scary looking buttons to enable third party installs, then manually update their own installed apps. Basically the risk would be someone like TikTok dropping out of the store, but I find that unlikely. Maybe at t…

DJI does not provide its app via play store and requires side loading :(

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#416

Post by LapsangGuzzler »

nerdjon wrote: post #68
LapsangGuzzler wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can never assume that one company represents your interests better than another: the solution to reducing addictive patterns is to enable other developers to build more privacy-oriented and dark-pattern-busting apps (one sec is a good example of this). Apple makes certain aspects of the phone addictive as well (i.e. the app tray that can't be disabled, Screen Time is a joke for actually trying to restrict how muc…

I agree that we should be talking about the addition problem of these apps. But I reference these specifically as being the gateway to more bad behavior. The idea of Facebook being able to introduce their own App Store for example that would allow other developers to engage in the same shady behavior. I only mention those apps since I feel like they have the addicted user base to be able to pull it off in a meaningfu…

Any technology can be abused and misused. If the bar for introducing any new technology was that it couldn't do harm to anyone, then nothing would ever change.

The current marketplace for apps gives us very limited choice in many ways, it's more of an illusion of choice in many cases. If 3rd-party marketplaces allow us to build more and less-private apps at the same time, I see that as a net positive.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#417

Post by yamtaddle »

WastingMyTime89 wrote: post #410
yamtaddle wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An alt-store stands to capture more value on iOS than Android, and spying on iOS users is probably a whole lot more lucrative than spying on Android users. That, combined with the App Store restricting spying more than the Play Store does, is why we can't necessarily expect the iOS ecosystem to behave the same way as Android's, were iOS to get similar side-loading capabilities. A common argument goes that nothing wil…

> An alt-store stands to capture more value on iOS than Android, and spying on iOS users is probably a whole lot more lucrative than spying on Android users. How so? I think American Apple users just don’t realise how insignificant Apple market share is outside the US. Android was open from the start. Giant like Amazon tried to kickstart alt stores. What did happen? Nothing. I think people should stop drinking Apple…

> > An alt-store stands to capture more value on iOS than Android, and spying on iOS users is probably a whole lot more lucrative than spying on Android users.

> How so?

What... part of this remains unclear? It's the same incentives that drive iOS-first development choices, with the added wrinkle that the App Store restricts the potential of certain monetization schemes (spying on users) more than the Play Store does. All that means the incentives to distribute apps outside the App Store, or to launch an alt-store, are stronger than on Android.

> I think American Apple users just don’t realise how insignificant Apple market share is outside the US.

I do realize. I think you may be overestimating how much all those Android users spend, and how much their eyeballs (and personal data) are worth to advertisers, compared with iOS users.

> Android was open from the start. Giant like Amazon tried to kick start all stores. What did happen? Nothing.

My entire point is that there are enough differences between the two that we can't assume they'll behave the same.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#418

Post by illiarian »

scarface74 wrote: post #408
illiarian wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That’s the reason that it has such a thriving tech ecosystem. By "market leaders" you mean the very many American companies fuelled by unlimited investor money that lose billions of dollars a year with no chance of ever turning a profit?

Or maybe the top five most valuable tech companies - Microsoft, Apple, Amazon, Facebook, Google. Even if that’s the case, why aren’t investors willing to invest in EU tech companies at the same level?

Hitory, lax laws (esp. around consumer protection) etc.

On top of that the US is a rather homogenous market with a single language vs. 27 conuntries with 27 different languages (in reality more) and quite a difference in local laws (even if all are compliant with EU-wide laws). IIRC there's also an expectation in Europe that companies should actually turn a profit at one point (though with influx of American money this is starting to change, too).

You still get ASML and Infineon, SAP, Adyen, Amadeus etc.

Re: iOS 17 will reportedly set the stage for sideloading apps on iPhone

#420

Post by stale2002 »

Man, I remember arguing with so many people, who were on complete copium, regarding this decision.

It should have been obvious, for anyone who has following this whole saga, that eventually Apple was going to be forced to open up.

Sure, maybe it was the Epic lawsuit that did it, but there were a dozen different vulerabilities, and pathways to them being forced to open up. If it wasn't that lawsuit, then it was going to be a new law, if not in america, then instead in the EU.

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