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Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

hetzner.com

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Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#171

Post by stonemetal12 »

mnau wrote: post #9
solalf wrote: post #3

Could somebody walk me through why ARM based servers are so inexpensive compared to their x86 counterparts? Is performance much lower? 16 cores & 32gb of RAM for less than 25 euros seems like a bargain.

Maybe competition? x86 has only 2 competitors left. ARM has more diverse ecosystem of competitors and the environments ha been different. ARM design had to be adjusted/developed for a cell phones often cost 10% of a normal computers (main use of x86). I can buy a cell phone a display, battery, memory and ARM cpu for $100 total (no idea how much ARM chip alone cost). The phone will have a semi-acceptable performance.…

Ampere is the only game in town for buying a server ARM chip. It isn't like anyone is rack mounting Samsung Galaxies, so the variety of manufactures working in other spaces doesn't really matter.

Nvidia claims to be working on getting in the server game later this year so maybe ARM will get to x86 levels of competition.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#172

Post by eis »

eis wrote: post #11

Great news. I'd like to see how a vCPU compares between arm64 and amd64 but not sure how to best go about it. I've created VMs for both with 4 vCPU and will run the phoronix benchmark suite. After that I'll probably try 16 arm vs 8 amd vCPU because that's a closer match in terms of price. Any suggestions welcome but I also don't want to spend too many hours on it. Will post results. Ran the kernel build benchmark (re…

Additional benchmarks:

sysbench memory --time=60 --threads=4 run

   AMD64: 5859951.00 per second
   ARM64: 6052749.14 per second
Here ARM had a lead.

Next up I timed compiling nodejs. time make -j4. I ran the test two times and took the faster result for each.

   AMD64: 
      real    28m46.385s
      user    107m48.971s
      sys     5m12.994s
   ARM64:
      real    39m18.443s
      user    146m25.801s
      sys     7m53.271s
Here ARM seems to be roughly 36% slower. This is actually pretty good considering the price difference.

Rescaled the ARM VM to 8 vCPUs:

      real    22m20.624s
      user    162m30.176s
      sys     8m50.104s
So now the ARM offering is noticably faster than the AMD instance but still cheaper. 12.49 Eur vs 13.60 Eur.

What I learn from these benchmarks is that you might get some really good value out of these ARM instances if your usecase is not impacted all too much in terms of performance.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#173

Post by nr2x »

Aldipower wrote: post #83
nr2x wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m currently setting up infrastructure for a startup and it’s been very interesting how the threat model of data loss and disaster recovery is no longer hardware failure: it’s account lock out. I’ve got streaming replication of my core data going from one cloud company to other company as that way if one has some antifraud system go rogue on me I still have access. As somebody who used to spend a lot of time thinkin…

Exactly. My main infrastructure is on Hetzner, but I have a live replication via Wireguard at another hoster in Austria. With less resources there, but for accessibility "in the case of".

I’m also thinking about buying a second hand server and racking it in a colocation joint just so I can physically get the disk. The client data I have is super important, and there is some level of comfort you only get from bare metal.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#174

Post by nr2x »

lelanthran wrote: post #75
nr2x wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me at least, if I knew I was getting same performance for less energy I’d actually be willing to pay a bit more. Data centers are big polluters still. I think we likely can get to nearly 100% renewables in the non-distant future, and lower energy per compute unit is part of that.

> For me at least, if I knew I was getting same performance for less energy I’d actually be willing to pay a bit more. Well if they're spending less to power my ARM machine, then they should damn well be charging me less to host it. That's the best, and only, long term path towards more efficient compute.

Interesting parallel is I have an electric car, which I pay more for and has limitations. But for me I think the societal benefit is great enough I’ll eat the cost. So if it gets data centers to invest in energy savings because they pocket the difference I’m ok with it.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#175

Post by banana_giraffe »

Havoc wrote: post #156
Jamie9912 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For comparison, here's an AWS a1.large instance (2cpus, 4GB ram) YABS benchmark I just ran https://gist.githubusercontent.com/12932/8ba27254846072a43b0...

Jikes. Why is the hdd read so bad? 6 MB/s. Six?

It's gated by the default IOPS limits, you'll note the larger block sizes have a considerably better throughput.

You can increase the IOPS, and thus the throughput for 4k operations, but at a cost, of course:

https://gist.githubusercontent.com/Q726kbXuN/7f03a9c11cab514...

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#176

Post by rnk »

nr2x wrote: post #62
Galaco wrote: post #38

Never figured out how to use Hertzner. Wanted to try since they get such a good reputation on here, but they banned my account when their system presented no way for me to verify my identity. The required either PayPal or passport. I have no PayPal account, and their 3rd party verification system only allows passport from your country of residence (signup requires providing a contact address and they pre fill using t…

I’m currently setting up infrastructure for a startup and it’s been very interesting how the threat model of data loss and disaster recovery is no longer hardware failure: it’s account lock out. I’ve got streaming replication of my core data going from one cloud company to other company as that way if one has some antifraud system go rogue on me I still have access. As somebody who used to spend a lot of time thinkin…

That's a very perceptive comment. It happens again and again and it's much harder to control for that, as compared to say making sure you are running in different amazon availability zones or something. If you wanted to destroy someone's service, probably getting them banned like you describe could even be easier than a DOS now. I worry about the day that google kills my gmail account for some random and never to be explained reason.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#177

Post by kornhole »

Galaco wrote: post #38

Never figured out how to use Hertzner. Wanted to try since they get such a good reputation on here, but they banned my account when their system presented no way for me to verify my identity. The required either PayPal or passport. I have no PayPal account, and their 3rd party verification system only allows passport from your country of residence (signup requires providing a contact address and they pre fill using t…

You get a good range of options at a low cost with Hetzner but need to identify yourself. Many hosting companies have different levels and types of verification these days. If you want to avoid any KYC, checkout https://kycnot.me/services#VPS.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#178

Post by bootsmann »

mardifoufs wrote: post #128
bootsmann wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We crawl through data like this professionally and from what we see, Hetzner isn't actually that bad at combating fraud. They are not GCP or AWS but there are other hosters of similar scale that have significantly worse response times and leave up clearly compromised machines for a lot longer.

I'm very curious to know who are the worst offenders! (If you can/want to share the details, obviously :) )

I cannot really comment on this because its A) a multi-dimensional problem (Hosters like Oracle have slightly longer mean removal time than Hetzner but less of their IPs end up in our aggregated blocklist, so does that make them worse or better idk) and B) we're trying to coax at least some of these hosters into using our service to support their fraud team so its probably best not to call out potential customers ;)

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#179

Post by FinnKuhn »

2000UltraDeluxe wrote: post #108
nixass wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The required either PayPal or passport I had similar struggles with some non-IT service providers in Germany. They couldn't fathom why I have non-German nationality, German address and driving license from third country. Passport, German address and driving license all have different address on them (all three being EU addresses). It is apparently huge red flag in EU in 21st century. Incredible

You have an address on your passport? I can see how that could cause issues if the address isn't valid. If I'd have to determine if your order was fraudulent or not, I'd err on the side of caution rather than risk having you abuse my server infrastructure (in the case of Hetzner).

German Passports have the City/Region you life in on them. The ID cards have your full address. So if the address of your ID card doesn't match your passport something is definitely fishy as you would have to get them updated when you move.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#180

Post by sine_break »

andix wrote: post #125
datenwolf wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of people confuse the passport (Pass) with the national identity card (Personalausweis). There's no place of residence stated on the German passport, but it is part of the Personalausweis. Since German citizens by law are required to own a Personalausweis (there's no mandate to carry it around, just having it somewhere in a drawer suffices), practically all businesses in Germany do rely on the Personalausweis t…

This is a very German thing. I’ve never seen ID cards from other countries that include an address of residence. Also the obligation to own an ID card is a very foreign concept in most other countries. I had that issue with German companies before, especially those who rarely deal with international customers. For example in Austria only a few people own an ID card (most people have a passport, but not everyone). So…

US does not have such cards, that is why they have issues with voter verification. Most countries have free IDs for citizens.
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