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A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

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Re: A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

#21

Post by jacquesm »

MrMember wrote: post #10

>Tosa, Marjanovic and Pilisi returned to the Ritz at 10 that night, as promised. This time they were led to a private room where a squad from the London Metropolitan Police was waiting. An officer politely informed them they were under arrest on suspicion of “deception” and led them away to be interviewed at a nearby police station. Once the gamblers were out of earshot, Wootten urged the cops to check their shoes an…

That jumped out at me too. You could lose 500K in a casino and nobody would bat an eye but win 500K and suddenly the police is involved and the casino refuses to pay out. Personally I think if they can't prove that you are cheating that you should be allowed to continue to play as long as you feel like and the casino stays afloat. What's good for the goose should be good for the gander. The police automatically siding with the casino and arresting people without any proof or even reasonable suspicion of wrongdoing other than the say so of a party that clearly isn't impartial is ridiculous.

Re: A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

#22

Post by jacquesm »

willcipriano wrote: post #17
ryandrake wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Casinos are pretty pathetic. They claim to run an honest game, and if you lose, they are totally fine with keeping your money. But, if you consistently win, and it looks even slightly statistically improbable, the casino turns into a crybaby health insurance adjuster, going over the rules/law with a magnifying glass to find something, anything that lets them avoid payment. At worst, the ones run by less savory organi…

I oppose efforts to legalize gambling not because I dislike gambling but I oppose the theft that we call legalized gambling.

The same theft is present in the lotteries and those are more often than not national affairs with the common pot as the beneficiary. Have you ever seen a wealthy person play the lottery?

Re: A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

#23

Post by nickthegreek »

jacquesm wrote: post #21
MrMember wrote: post #10

>Tosa, Marjanovic and Pilisi returned to the Ritz at 10 that night, as promised. This time they were led to a private room where a squad from the London Metropolitan Police was waiting. An officer politely informed them they were under arrest on suspicion of “deception” and led them away to be interviewed at a nearby police station. Once the gamblers were out of earshot, Wootten urged the cops to check their shoes an…

That jumped out at me too. You could lose 500K in a casino and nobody would bat an eye but win 500K and suddenly the police is involved and the casino refuses to pay out. Personally I think if they can't prove that you are cheating that you should be allowed to continue to play as long as you feel like and the casino stays afloat. What's good for the goose should be good for the gander. The police automatically sidin…

Normally they just ask you leave and/or ban you. But they should still be paying out any winnings if they cant prove any wrongdoing.

Re: A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

#24

Post by zamnos »

htrp wrote: post #15

if these are the people i think they are, they practiced a ton to train themselves to be able to identify the underlying physical aspects, in effect memorizing how to do everything the computer would nominally do. if you know wheel rpm plus an estimate of the speed the croupier throws the ball, you can get a pretty good physics sim of where the ball lands.

There's a similar urban legend about craps. That with enough practice, you can get good enough at throwing the dice at the exact right place to get, again, not a visible advantage, but a just ever so slightly higher statistical advantage. Sounds impossible, but looking at the level of skill a world class athlete has encourages me to believe in this urban legend.

Re: A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

#25

Post by Pulcinella »

willcipriano wrote: post #17
ryandrake wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Casinos are pretty pathetic. They claim to run an honest game, and if you lose, they are totally fine with keeping your money. But, if you consistently win, and it looks even slightly statistically improbable, the casino turns into a crybaby health insurance adjuster, going over the rules/law with a magnifying glass to find something, anything that lets them avoid payment. At worst, the ones run by less savory organi…

I oppose efforts to legalize gambling not because I dislike gambling but I oppose the theft that we call legalized gambling.

Interesting fact: As far as I am aware, it’s illegal to gamble at the casino in Monte Carlo unless you are a foreigner (I.e. it is not legal for citizens of Monaco to gamble there). Probably because the country isn’t actually bringing in any new money if locals gamble.

There really is no reason to legalize gambling casinos. It is just an inefficient way of moving money around. It doesn’t actually create new value for society as a whole. (Friendly poker games amongst friends and family with small pots are probably fine).

Re: A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

#26

Post by jamal-kumar »

A couple of notes from my own experience in casino hacking fun:

1. if they spot you singularly winning way too hard, they will cut you off 2. if you can distribute the wins wide enough between enough individuals you might get away with it

There ARE exploits and you can get away with them. People find them pretty regularly and the ones who get away with it are really organized.

My favorites over the past years: Weak PRNG in the Buffalo slot machines [1], and people cleaning that, and the guy who figured out an exploit in the game king brand video poker machines [2] - One got away with it and the other didn't, it's worth being aware of how.

[1] https://www.wired.com/2017/02/russians-engineer-brilliant-sl...

[2] https://www.wired.com/2013/05/game-king/

Re: A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

#27

Post by paulryanrogers »

eloisant wrote: post #18
ryandrake wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Casinos are pretty pathetic. They claim to run an honest game, and if you lose, they are totally fine with keeping your money. But, if you consistently win, and it looks even slightly statistically improbable, the casino turns into a crybaby health insurance adjuster, going over the rules/law with a magnifying glass to find something, anything that lets them avoid payment. At worst, the ones run by less savory organi…

More concerning is that the police and judges will follow on the casino's requests.

Sad because they know who pays their bills, however indirectly, yet it's the little people getting hurt who need protection of the courts the most.

Re: A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

#28

Post by mathgeek »

tzs wrote: post #20

The "Roulette Assault" episode of the old History Channel series "Breaking Vegas" covers another way to beat roulette but without requiring computers or communications devices in the casino or timing anything. Archive.org has a copy of that episode [1]. A family went to casinos around Europe and observed the roulette wheels, keeping extensive records on where the ball landed. They were not covert about it. They'd jus…

If you read the article to its conclusion, the biased wheel method is covered in some depth.

Re: A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

#29

Post by no_wizard »

tzs wrote: post #20

The "Roulette Assault" episode of the old History Channel series "Breaking Vegas" covers another way to beat roulette but without requiring computers or communications devices in the casino or timing anything. Archive.org has a copy of that episode [1]. A family went to casinos around Europe and observed the roulette wheels, keeping extensive records on where the ball landed. They were not covert about it. They'd jus…

Another interesting aspect I remember from the "Counterfeit King" story is that Rhode Island actually had no laws against this counterfeiting, so the way they ended up getting him was interesting too, they were only able to arrest him once he crossed state lines with the counterfeit chips, IIRC

Re: A Gambler Who Beat Roulette

#30

Post by 0cf8612b2e1e »

jamal-kumar wrote: post #26

A couple of notes from my own experience in casino hacking fun: 1. if they spot you singularly winning way too hard, they will cut you off 2. if you can distribute the wins wide enough between enough individuals you might get away with it There ARE exploits and you can get away with them. People find them pretty regularly and the ones who get away with it are really organized. My favorites over the past years: Weak P…

“Got away with it” would imply they committed an elaborate scheme. It sounds like they played the game with a strategy and never broke any rules. Except the cardinal one that the House always wins.
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