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Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

france24.com

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Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#531

Post by RestlessMind »

TheHappyOddish wrote: post #402
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> survey in Norway showed that over half of the trips on rental scooters replaced public transit, and less than 10% replaced trips in private cars I’d be careful about extrapolating these results across cities. In most American cities, for example, I’m going to replace an e-scooter with an Uber.

Most of the modern world has common public transport, the US is a weird edge case.

You clearly haven't explored the modern world then. Or may have visited 3-5 cities and think you have seen it all. Some non-US metro areas where I found public transport to be inadequate based on my travels in the last 3-4 months - Toronto, Vancouver, Bangalore, Mumbai.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#532

Post by KptMarchewa »

walthamstow wrote: post #454
np- wrote: post #437

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just an American thing, try jaywalking in Germany, they consider it so offensive that even some mothers will shield their children’s eyes to prevent them seeing you do it. You must be British, thinking you speak for the world ;)

After just two days in Vienna I changed from my London crossing style to the local style. The social pressure was just too great.

After week in London I've started to go on red in Warsaw. Life is too short to wait when nobody's driving.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#533

Post by dijit »

bombcar wrote: post #476
dijit wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Now a last misconception is that this ban is bad because people will revert to cars. No they won't. In the first place, people riding rental e-scooters do not replace a car trip by a rental e-scooter trip This is a hard one to qualify completely. There is a lot of statistical evidence that infers that greater usage of e-Scooters and e-Bikes decreases car traffic. That may not be the case in Paris (and I can definit…

> There are other points though, "last mile" is a difficult problem "Last mile" is literally solved with two legs and some shoes. A mile is walked in 15-30 minutes, and if you can scooter you can walk. The actually mobility-challenged can be provided vehicles if necessary.

I mean, it's not, because if the options are too time consuming too uncertain and/or too inconvenient people will move further away and buy a car (then expect that everywhere they go to have open roads and 12sqm of open space wherever they decide to stop).

To break down what you're suggesting, imagine 20-25 minutes walk to the train station, 10 minutes waiting for the train (you want to be early if it's an infrequent train!), 30 minutes on a train, 20-25 minutes walk on the other side.

For what looks like a quick walk and a "comfortable" 30 minute train journey you're suddenly realising that a lot of your day has gone. Somewhere in the region of 1hr20m - 1.5hrs~ has gone to your "30 minute" commute, and that's twice a day.

You could reduce both walks, and instead: bike or scooter (which are roughly three times faster on average) that journey collapses from 1h20m (in the best case) to under an hour for the worst case... (6-8.5 mins or so for each last-mile instead of 20-25)

And I mean, do this twice a day?... For a month?

That's 16 hours saved.

Last mile is not solved by ignoring it and telling people they have legs, that logic is what boomers use to tell us we're all living wrong for having a lifestyle that isn't revolving around servitude and living to work..

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#534

Post by WJW »

edanm wrote: post #475
WJW wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well. You are legally allowed to drive a car around, but will still get stones thrown at your car if you do so in an ultra-orthodox neighborhood.

I just want to make it clear that you're talking about a very very specific thing, which has nothing to do with the daily existence of most non-Jewish-religious Israelis. I mention this cause you make it sound like this is something more than it is. The vast majority of the Israeli population drives their car on Saturday.

Fair. I did mention that it was only in the Haredi neighborhoods, but you're right that that is not a majority activity. Public transport does shut down though, even for citizens who wouldn't otherwise care and even in areas of the country without an (ultra-)orthodox majority.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#535

Post by WJW »

TheHappyOddish wrote: post #405
zirgs wrote: post #399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/91594/theres-wire-above-... There's a wire around Manhattan. And it costs 100k a year to maintain it.

> The eruv encircles much of Manhattan, acting as a symbolic boundary that turns the very public streets of the city into a private space, much like one's own home. This allows people to freely communicate and socialize on the Sabbath—and carry whatever they please—without having to worry about breaking Jewish law. This article seems to assume a lot of existing knowledge about Jewish "laws". To provide further inform…

> I can't imagine God at judgement time going "Well you got me on a technicality, head on up you cheeky rascals", but I guess they know him better than me.

The reasoning goes like this:

- God is perfect and omniscient.

- The Jewish laws come pretty much directly from God.

- Therefore the law is perfect as written, because to assume that a mortal could ever find an error in the laws of a perfect God would be an act of the purest hubris.

- Therefore there are no unintentional loopholes, because God is perfect. Any "loopholes" were put in there on purpose by God, as Easter eggs or as rewards for those who studied diligently enough to notice them.

- Therefore any "loopholes" which stand the test of time (and with that the thorough inspection of other experts of Jewish law) are to be celebrated. They were surely found by a person with great knowledge of the Holy Book, which is to be admired.

So yes, in the Jewish perspective God would indeed go something "you got me on a technicality, well done!" when judgement day comes. I'm not sure if I agree, but I do admire the internal consistency of the belief. It does seem pretty heretical to presume you know better than the actual Bible after all, and surely an omnipotent and omniscient God is capable of writing down exactly what He means.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#536

Post by regularjack »

slowmotiony wrote: post #455
regularjack wrote: post #442

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On foot, metro, bike, bus. Paris probably has one of the best metro networks in the world.

Its also one of the most sketchy and dangerous. If you hop on an escooter, you're not going to find a homeless dude there jerking off, there's no vomit anywhere, noone will assault your wife and you're not getting stabbed nor mugged. Can't say the same about the Paris metro.

I'm sure what you describe happens, but I've used the Paris metro everyday for years and never had any of those things happen to me, nor have I witnessed it happening to others.

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#537

Post by edanm »

WJW wrote: post #534
edanm wrote: post #475

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just want to make it clear that you're talking about a very very specific thing, which has nothing to do with the daily existence of most non-Jewish-religious Israelis. I mention this cause you make it sound like this is something more than it is. The vast majority of the Israeli population drives their car on Saturday.

Fair. I did mention that it was only in the Haredi neighborhoods, but you're right that that is not a majority activity. Public transport does shut down though, even for citizens who wouldn't otherwise care and even in areas of the country without an (ultra-)orthodox majority.

Oh yes, absolutely, that's a pretty awful state of affairs that causes a lot of issues (e.g. people who otherwise could've done without a car, are basically forced to have one if they want to get anywhere on the weekend.)

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#538

Post by __derek__ »

eastbound wrote: post #148
arijun wrote: post #47

I would like to provide a contrasting viewpoint. I can’t speak to the situation in Paris, but in the city I live in, scooters are amazing. They reduce car usage which is better for both pedestrians and car users. They turn a 45 minute walk/30 minute bus ride/20 minute cab into a 10-15 minute trip, which opens up much more of the city (the city I live in was not built for the number of cars it has in it so getting any…

> but between an aggressive ticketing campaign That’s how you solved it. Paris is entirely unable to perform such a campaign, because it would “target minorities unfairly” as they say, and Paris is at something like 10x fewer policemen per population compared to the average of US cities, which puts Paris in the category of “self-managed” much more than other cities of the same size.

This line of reasoning has actually been used by Seattle activists to resist installation of traffic cameras.[1] Our city also refuses to enforce any traffic laws generally.

[1]: https://southseattleemerald.com/2023/03/01/opinion-seattles-...

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#539

Post by bombcar »

dijit wrote: post #533
bombcar wrote: post #476

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There are other points though, "last mile" is a difficult problem "Last mile" is literally solved with two legs and some shoes. A mile is walked in 15-30 minutes, and if you can scooter you can walk. The actually mobility-challenged can be provided vehicles if necessary.

I mean, it's not, because if the options are too time consuming too uncertain and/or too inconvenient people will move further away and buy a car (then expect that everywhere they go to have open roads and 12sqm of open space wherever they decide to stop). To break down what you're suggesting, imagine 20-25 minutes walk to the train station, 10 minutes waiting for the train (you want to be early if it's an infrequent…

The problem down that argument, is if we go by time alone, the car wins almost every time (there are a few cities with certain commutes that are faster by transit, but not many, even WITH traffic jams).

Re: Paris votes to ban rental e-scooters

#540

Post by renewiltord »

anhner wrote: post #212
renewiltord wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just walk past them when I'm not using them. Very easy. Hardly a problem.

Perhaps because you don't have a disability or a stroller with a young child so that you can comfortably and effortlessly avoid them...

Had a motorcycle accident. Completely pulverized. ICU for a week. Got out and was driven everywhere for a while, but when I walked these were not a substantial burden.
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