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Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

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Re: Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

#211

Post by public_defender »

unsupp0rted wrote: post #175
public_defender wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In addition to being toxic and irrelevant to the parent comments (who mentioned kids?), This argument is a red herring. Of course if everyone dies, we mitigate anthropogenic climate change, but that doesn't really further our analysis of the issue. There is nothing inherent in children that uses carbon, it is human behavior in the context of petro-capitalism that uses carbon. If I have thirteen kids and they live on…

Labeling a comment “Toxic” is a good way to shut down interesting discussion. The parent said: > [international flights taken often] completely dwarfs any [CO2] savings I could reasonably expect to make. What dwarfs CO2 savings isn’t so much an individual’s international flights, it’s an individual creating more individuals that create more individuals. Your thirteen kids on a farm cooperative are likely to have and…

> Labeling a comment “Toxic” is a good way to shut down interesting discussion.

That's certainly your opinion. My opinion is that this thread of analysis (a) is not interesting; (b) tends to propagate harm.

I think the discussion is not interesting because it lacks intellectual rigor. I mentioned that the subject of having kids is an irrelevant red herring. I think we can call your thesis a form of "whataboutism." You actually double down on this in your response. Kids on a farm? Whatabout cows? (It's a vegetable farm. Try again, I guess.) Let me also add that there is no logical limit to your analysis. Who is responsible for your carbon use? You or your parents? Is this toxic comment on the internet something I should address with you or your grandmother?

The harm-causing part is more important. You are saying--here and in siblings--that "other people" can/should have children and that society will be sustained by babies who are "born anyway," but that people who procreate have lost the moral agency to participate as your equals in the climate discussion.

This is toxic (harm-propagating) because it treats biological procreation as a distasteful externality. Procreation is not an external process when we are considering anthropogenic climate change. Worse, you are drawing an artificial line to separate people who can have valid policy opinions on climate change from those (parents) who can't. Ironically, this is the same thing that you accused me of doing when you objected to my use of the word "toxic."

Re: Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

#212

Post by yosito »

severino wrote: post #180
WheatMillington wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

If you're worried about climate change, you should not spend your time and resources trying to reduce your own CO2 emissions, but instead, supporting and promoting regulations that force people like yosito to not being able to travel that much, so they will also forcibly start to reduce their footprint.

I get what you're saying about limiting air travel, but let's look at the bigger picture.

Commercial flights make up around 2% of global carbon emissions, so forcing people like me not to travel is not going to make a significant dent in climate change. Focusing on industries and companies that are responsible for the bulk of emissions might be a better way to go.

Rather than trying to control individuals, we need to hold industries and corporations accountable. Pushing for policies that target high-emitting sectors like energy, transportation, and agriculture can create real change. By tackling the main culprits, we have a better shot at making a difference.

Cheers!

Re: Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

#213

Post by prepend »

worldsayshi wrote: post #186
klntsky wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For every child you don't have I'm going to have two.

[flagged]

Not having children is certainly not the ultimate sacrifice. That seems like a really silly sentiment.

I think suicide would be the ultimate sacrifice, although stupid for climate change. Ultimate because it’s the last act and ultimate because it’s everything that can be spent.

As far as difficulty, devoting one’s life to improving the environment is a bigger sacrifice than childlessness.

And raising positive children is much harder and more of a sacrifice than choosing not to have children. As far as difficulty, it’s like choosing to go to the gym two hours every day vs not.

Re: Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

#214

Post by eloisant »

abliefern wrote: post #164
eloisant wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the reality of air travel, 90% of the flights (thus the CO2 emissions) are made by a handful of frequent travellers. Moreover those are very unlikely to be willing to cut on air travel for CO2 emission reasons. So you shouldn't feel bad for your occasional air travel.

> So you shouldn't feel bad for your occasional air travel. I don't understand the implied ethical rule behind this mentality. CO2 emissions are always a problem and to be avoided. What am I missing?

CO2 emissions are going to happen, we need to reduce them in a meaningful way. We do that by looking at the breakdown of emissions.

The biggest sector is enery use in the industry (24%), next is buildings, mostly heating (17.5), then transport (16%). Most of the transport emissions is road transport (cars and trucks) and air travel is only 2% of the overall emissions.

https://ourworldindata.org/emissions-by-sector

And again, air travel is mostly frequent travelers who have no intention to change their habit. That means that as an occasional air traveler, if it makes you happy to visit a faraway country every few years, you should definitely not feel bad about it. Because even if all occasional travelers were to stop flying, it wouldn't make any significant difference.

Re: Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

#215

Post by yosito »

pimterry wrote: post #128
medstrom wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another hack is timing. Often I've taken a day off on either Friday or Monday when I'm travelling over the weekend -- the difference in cost can be as much as a day's wage.

This is a lovely benefit of remote working for me - any time I travel, I can shift the days around to significantly save on flight costs, but without losing the day's wage. I can just work from wherever I am without taking any time off. Usually saves at least €100 each way, every time I travel, and occasionally much more. And as a bonus, it's quite nice to spend a day working from a coworking space in a random city e…

I prefer to work in coffee shops. A €2 coffee every two hours is cheap and I'm gonna buy it anyway.

Re: Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

#216

Post by nazgul17 »

unsupp0rted wrote: post #200
allendoerfer wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get your point and am on neither side of the fence here, since I do not think, we should rely on individual action at all. I just want to add to the conversation, that somehow your reasoning strikes me as a bit selfish. It is of course true, what you are writing. Still reading it, makes me sad. I am missing some higher meaning. Who cares about a career in the end? A career in our system is just a story of someone,…

What's selfish about not having children? To whom or to what do I owe bringing a child into the world? It's more likely the opposite: a lot of people would agree that their parents' decision to have children, particularly at a time when they couldn't afford them or lacked the mental strength to care for them and raise them in psychological safety, was selfish.

To my children, who will labour to sustain you, too, in your late life.

Re: Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

#217

Post by yosito »

AdamN wrote: post #99
yosito wrote: post #67

I've been flying internationally 10-15 times a year for ~10 years. Different routes and destinations each time. I've spent a lot of time searching for hacks like this that let me save a few bucks on flight tickets. Sometimes it works. Sometimes you find that a flight is cheaper depending on which country's website or currency you use to book. Flight tickets are priced dynamically using a variety of factors to determi…

Do you recommend Kiwi/SkyScanner for their customer support (changing tickets, etc...) or are those just names you sometimes use? I also fly a few times a year and at this point I just want excellent customer service and don't worry about saving a few bucks but haven't found a travel agent that meets my needs. Chase Ultimate Rewards just kind of meh. I do know the value of booking directly with the airline but someti…

Honestly, I've given up on expecting any kind of customer support from any travel agent at all, even buying tickets directly from the airlines. Customer service in 2023 is a shitshow.

Re: Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

#218

Post by unsupp0rted »

public_defender wrote: post #211
unsupp0rted wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Labeling a comment “Toxic” is a good way to shut down interesting discussion. The parent said: > [international flights taken often] completely dwarfs any [CO2] savings I could reasonably expect to make. What dwarfs CO2 savings isn’t so much an individual’s international flights, it’s an individual creating more individuals that create more individuals. Your thirteen kids on a farm cooperative are likely to have and…

> Labeling a comment “Toxic” is a good way to shut down interesting discussion. That's certainly your opinion. My opinion is that this thread of analysis (a) is not interesting; (b) tends to propagate harm. I think the discussion is not interesting because it lacks intellectual rigor. I mentioned that the subject of having kids is an irrelevant red herring. I think we can call your thesis a form of "whataboutism." Yo…

"You shouldn't be allowed to walk around as a tourist in this archaeological site because you're trampling it"

"Why are you telling me where I can't go while blowing up large chunks of it with dynamite?"

"That's whataboutism. Besides maybe my dynamite isn't causing any damage, and I'm still right that you're trampling it."

Re: Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

#219

Post by yosito »

1vuio0pswjnm7 wrote: post #107
yosito wrote: post #67

I've been flying internationally 10-15 times a year for ~10 years. Different routes and destinations each time. I've spent a lot of time searching for hacks like this that let me save a few bucks on flight tickets. Sometimes it works. Sometimes you find that a flight is cheaper depending on which country's website or currency you use to book. Flight tickets are priced dynamically using a variety of factors to determi…

Why book through Kiwi or Skyscanner if booking through Chase earns triple rewards points.

Because the rewards points can only be redeemed for flights that are priced 3x as much as the kiwi flights. I've done the math many times, and it never comes out ahead. Just go for the flights with the cheapest price.

Re: Can you buy the same ticket at a lower price if you buy it from another country?

#220

Post by effingwewt »

unsupp0rted wrote: post #200
allendoerfer wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get your point and am on neither side of the fence here, since I do not think, we should rely on individual action at all. I just want to add to the conversation, that somehow your reasoning strikes me as a bit selfish. It is of course true, what you are writing. Still reading it, makes me sad. I am missing some higher meaning. Who cares about a career in the end? A career in our system is just a story of someone,…

What's selfish about not having children? To whom or to what do I owe bringing a child into the world? It's more likely the opposite: a lot of people would agree that their parents' decision to have children, particularly at a time when they couldn't afford them or lacked the mental strength to care for them and raise them in psychological safety, was selfish.

Accidents happen, and now with Roe V Wade repeal even more will.

Not everyone gets to make the conscious choice.

Sounds more like you've given up and are using it as the moral high ground.

To turn your earlier phrase- 'Sorry, I don't take advice from people who are removed from the human race.'

Sounds stupid, because it is.

You do what you can, I will do what I can. But don't think for a second you are better than anyone else over a single choice you made.

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