US bars friends over Twitter joke • Hacker News Board

Re: US bars friends over Twitter joke

#211

Post by 13rules » Tue, Jan 31, 2012, 6:37 AM UTC

nkoren wrote: post #172

cookiecaper wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget Ron Paul as one of Obama's serious opponents that still advocates liberty.

Eh, I'm not sure I'd call him "serious". He's definitely pretty good on some civil liberty issues. Rather less so if you happen to be female, non-white, or gay. Even if that wasn't the case, his understanding of economics is sufficiently loony as to exclude him from serious consideration, at least in my view. In any case, a belief in civil liberties shouldn't even be a discrete political position ; it should be the b…

"Rather less so if you happen to be female, non-white, or gay."

[citation needed]

You are way off base on this one and have nothing to back this up. Ron Paul has consistently been for every American. He is for repealing Roe v. Wade and allowing states to decide on abortion rights, he has been outspoken on the bias of prison sentences and the death penalty on minorities, and is against a federal mandate on marriage. Those positions are exactly contrarian to the ones you are attempting to assign to him.

I'm not sure why you think his understanding of economics is "loony" as he is the ONLY member of congress that predicted the housing collapse YEARS before it happened (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnuoHx9BINc)

Neither Bush nor Obama ever championed liberty. Ron Paul is a completely different animal. He isn't promising to GIVE you anything — he's promising to reduce government to get OUT of your life. Big difference.

Re: US bars friends over Twitter joke

#212

Post by ahrens » Tue, Jan 31, 2012, 6:50 AM UTC

13rules wrote: post #211

nkoren wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, I'm not sure I'd call him "serious". He's definitely pretty good on some civil liberty issues. Rather less so if you happen to be female, non-white, or gay. Even if that wasn't the case, his understanding of economics is sufficiently loony as to exclude him from serious consideration, at least in my view. In any case, a belief in civil liberties shouldn't even be a discrete political position ; it should be the b…

"Rather less so if you happen to be female, non-white, or gay." [citation needed] You are way off base on this one and have nothing to back this up. Ron Paul has consistently been for every American. He is for repealing Roe v. Wade and allowing states to decide on abortion rights, he has been outspoken on the bias of prison sentences and the death penalty on minorities, and is against a federal mandate on marriage. T…

Without knowing much about Ron Paul, I was shocked to see you call Paul for females by repealing Roe vs Wade! Abortion should always be a womans own choice, not something the government should meddle with.

Re: US bars friends over Twitter joke

#213

Post by 13rules » Tue, Jan 31, 2012, 7:06 AM UTC

ahrens wrote: post #212

13rules wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Rather less so if you happen to be female, non-white, or gay." [citation needed] You are way off base on this one and have nothing to back this up. Ron Paul has consistently been for every American. He is for repealing Roe v. Wade and allowing states to decide on abortion rights, he has been outspoken on the bias of prison sentences and the death penalty on minorities, and is against a federal mandate on marriage. T…

Without knowing much about Ron Paul, I was shocked to see you call Paul for females by repealing Roe vs Wade! Abortion should always be a womans own choice, not something the government should meddle with.

I see your point. Paul is against abortion, but because of his strong constitutional stance is for states rights >>> federal mandates.

Whether abortion should be legal or illegal is another discussion I guess.

Re: US bars friends over Twitter joke

#214

Post by perfunctory » Tue, Jan 31, 2012, 7:45 AM UTC

lignuist wrote: post #191

maaku wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps, but it's a reasonable way to catch mentally unstable people acting out crazy fantasies... Such people might actually post their plans on twitter.

What if authorities cannot distinguish between such utterances and bad jokes? (Obviously they can't) I think, many people would change the way they communicate, if a single silly tweet can have legal consequences or even can destroy their lives.

Oh yes they will. This is exactly what's happening in authoritarian countries around the world.

Re: US bars friends over Twitter joke

#215

Post by perfunctory » Tue, Jan 31, 2012, 7:51 AM UTC

swombat wrote: post #118

netcan wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

some gems: serves them right for putting up stupid comments like that on a public site where the world can see At least the yanks have got it right. If that was here, it would be completly different... they would be welcome even more with a brass band waiting for them at arrivals with hand outs, benefits and housing all sorted for them Perhaps if they spoke or 'tweeted' to each other in proper English................…

Well, it is the Sun we're talking about here. It does have a very specific target audience.

Very specific? The sun "has ... the largest circulation of any daily newspaper in the United Kingdom" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sun_%28United_Kingdom%29) Looks like the specific audience you are talking about is the majority of the population.

Re: US bars friends over Twitter joke

#216

Post by corin_ » Tue, Jan 31, 2012, 8:07 AM UTC

13rules wrote: post #211

nkoren wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, I'm not sure I'd call him "serious". He's definitely pretty good on some civil liberty issues. Rather less so if you happen to be female, non-white, or gay. Even if that wasn't the case, his understanding of economics is sufficiently loony as to exclude him from serious consideration, at least in my view. In any case, a belief in civil liberties shouldn't even be a discrete political position ; it should be the b…

"Rather less so if you happen to be female, non-white, or gay." [citation needed] You are way off base on this one and have nothing to back this up. Ron Paul has consistently been for every American. He is for repealing Roe v. Wade and allowing states to decide on abortion rights, he has been outspoken on the bias of prison sentences and the death penalty on minorities, and is against a federal mandate on marriage. T…

I'm not even American, and I think I can safely speak for 99% of gay Americans when I say that the grandparent comment was right in saying Ron Paul is anti-gay.

Abortion rights... well from this side of the pond we think it's nutty that anyone in your country can want abortion to be illegal, literally crazy. But whatever your view, pro-choice can argue that they're fighting for woman's rights, pro-life cannot - you can argue you're fighting for the rights of babies, meaning it's an issue not relevant to whether Ron Paul is good for women.

In the past he has somehow tried to blame those sexually harrassed in the workplace for being sexually harrassed - something that is far more a women's issue than not.

Overall he's a far-right (shockingly not the furthest right thanks to batshit teapartyers) Republican. I get that there are Americans who agree with his views, but don't try and argue that his views on these topics are universally considered correct - even in America.

Re: US bars friends over Twitter joke

#217

Post by GFischer » Tue, Jan 31, 2012, 11:14 AM UTC

electic wrote: post #196

jsavimbi wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that it has become worse, it's just that all those crazy things that happened after 9/11 have become institutionalized and bureaucratically entrenched. Good luck getting rid of stupid when stupid has a budget.

"Good luck getting rid of stupid when stupid has a budget." I love that line. Catchy.

Similar quote:

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it"

Upton Sinclair

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Upton_Sinclair

Re: US bars friends over Twitter joke

#218

Post by GFischer » Tue, Jan 31, 2012, 11:25 AM UTC

mseebach wrote: post #88

panacea wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just a small data-point, but I was seriously worried about visiting the US based on what I'd heard about customs and immigration there. And this is from a white 'middle-class' male living in London with no beard. I ended up visiting anyway (I really wanted to research Philly Cheesesteaks, Maine Lobster and see the colours of the New England Autumn/Fall), but I definitely thought long and hard about it and was…

Any friction will ultimately affect "conversions", although I think the friction is probably smaller that we'd think. Most people don't spend much time reading and fretting about the TSA online, so for those, standing in line for half an hour and having your passport stamped is just part of the excitement of travelling (for less experienced travelers). As a fraction of the total time and bother of intercontinental tr…

"Most people don't spend much time reading and fretting about the TSA online"

That's only true for countries under the U.S. Visa Waiver, which are maybe 5% of the world's population (basically European Union and Australia).

For the remaining 93% of us, we have to think long and hard and plan far ahead before visiting the U.S., and that means being aware of all the issues or risk deportation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_Waiver_Program

And yes, I believe it does affect conversion significantly, but, coincidentally, we're the poorer 93% .

Re: US bars friends over Twitter joke

#219

Post by GFischer » Tue, Jan 31, 2012, 11:30 AM UTC

drucken wrote: post #185

This is extremely unpleasant given the vast reach of US authorities worldwide, let alone just for entry into the US. Someone could ruin your life based on just your name just by impersonating you or simply having the same name on social networking while acting in some way an authority finds offensive, even if you yourself have never used it! It would seem you are actually safer to be the first to create closed and pr…

Yes, you can be in serious trouble just by having the misfortune of sharing a name with a terrorist:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Fly_List

Even senator Edward Kennedy had trouble with that one.

Re: US bars friends over Twitter joke

#220

Post by swombat » Tue, Jan 31, 2012, 2:23 PM UTC

perfunctory wrote: post #215

swombat wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, it is the Sun we're talking about here. It does have a very specific target audience.

Very specific? The sun "has ... the largest circulation of any daily newspaper in the United Kingdom" ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sun_%28United_Kingdom%29 ) Looks like the specific audience you are talking about is the majority of the population.

Yes, it is. That's a sad reflection on our civilisation.