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Companies to publish salary ranges in job adverts under new EU rules

businesspost.ie

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Re: Companies to publish salary ranges in job adverts under new EU rules

#11

Post by nonethewiser »

bdw5204 wrote: post #3

From the article, it isn't clear whether a pay range of minimum wage to 1 million euros would be in compliance with this new rule. This is an actual tactic that many US employers have used to follow the letter but not the spirit of salary transparency laws.

I have also seen them spelled out in massive walls of text. Petty as fuck.

Carefully scan the disclaimer section at the bottom for:

> Colorado, New York City, California, and Washington Candidates Only. The salary range for this position is seventy thousand dollars to one hundred forty-seven thousand five hundred dollars.

https://www.myrocketcareer.com/job-detail-page/16777898/soft...

Re: Companies to publish salary ranges in job adverts under new EU rules

#14

Post by motohagiography »

The two reasons I disagree with publishing salaries and "ranges" are that a) the implicit collusion creates mean reversion that disadvantages talent, who can afford to leave and go where they are valued and b) the values behind it presume that a job is something paternalistic granted by a manager in return for supplication, and not due consideration for value offered. Together these create a race to the bottom in office culture, where people optimize to compete not on competence and value, but on debasing themselves and attrition with others.

Sure, if you are doing government work, (which is basically a sinecure anyway) this is fine, but any country that implements it will only ever be a kind of outsourced piecework shop, like a maquilladora or "friendshoring," where the real talent who manages the work and handles the money will be in places with rational incentives.

Re: Companies to publish salary ranges in job adverts under new EU rules

#15

Post by andyferris »

WheatMillington wrote: post #10
stefan_ wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

.. why on earth would we preserve that? Should supermarkets not show prices?

Supermarkets should not have to disclose their COST prices, because these are non public negotiations, not a public offer to buy/sell. That so many people wilfully choose not to understand this distinction frustrates useful conversation.

I agree it's orthogonal to the original discussion, but I am interested in the hyptothesis that we'd be all better off if e.g. we could see the cost prices at supermarkets (and perhaps all their other relevant costs). E.g. is society better or worse off with less secrecy?

Re: Companies to publish salary ranges in job adverts under new EU rules

#16

Post by nonethewiser »

motohagiography wrote: post #14

The two reasons I disagree with publishing salaries and "ranges" are that a) the implicit collusion creates mean reversion that disadvantages talent, who can afford to leave and go where they are valued and b) the values behind it presume that a job is something paternalistic granted by a manager in return for supplication, and not due consideration for value offered. Together these create a race to the bottom in off…

I guess I like seeing the range as an applicant, but I do strongly agree with you in terms of paying people based off what they can command as individuals.

Does a large range absolve your concerns?

Re: Companies to publish salary ranges in job adverts under new EU rules

#17

Post by 121789 »

motohagiography wrote: post #14

The two reasons I disagree with publishing salaries and "ranges" are that a) the implicit collusion creates mean reversion that disadvantages talent, who can afford to leave and go where they are valued and b) the values behind it presume that a job is something paternalistic granted by a manager in return for supplication, and not due consideration for value offered. Together these create a race to the bottom in off…

I don’t understand the logic around transparency not giving an advantage to talent, could you expand? Certainly seems like there are counter examples in many places where compensation is public

Re: Companies to publish salary ranges in job adverts under new EU rules

#18

Post by slg »

motohagiography wrote: post #14

The two reasons I disagree with publishing salaries and "ranges" are that a) the implicit collusion creates mean reversion that disadvantages talent, who can afford to leave and go where they are valued and b) the values behind it presume that a job is something paternalistic granted by a manager in return for supplication, and not due consideration for value offered. Together these create a race to the bottom in off…

>a) the implicit collusion creates mean reversion that disadvantages talent, who can afford to leave and go where they are valued

Doesn't this logic rest on the assumption that companies that pay better than average are doing it accidentally? Facebook has a reputation for paying better than many other tech companies for example. If I know that, Facebook surely knows that. Why would they stop doing that just because other companies are publishing their pay ranges?

Re: Companies to publish salary ranges in job adverts under new EU rules

#20

Post by aikinai »

121789 wrote: post #17
motohagiography wrote: post #14

The two reasons I disagree with publishing salaries and "ranges" are that a) the implicit collusion creates mean reversion that disadvantages talent, who can afford to leave and go where they are valued and b) the values behind it presume that a job is something paternalistic granted by a manager in return for supplication, and not due consideration for value offered. Together these create a race to the bottom in off…

I don’t understand the logic around transparency not giving an advantage to talent, could you expand? Certainly seems like there are counter examples in many places where compensation is public

I'm not sure if I completely follow the parent, but I would also be concerned since it means it'll be far more difficult to negotiate above the range. In the obfuscated market, if you are good at proving your value and negotiating, then the usual range people have in mind for that type of job becomes less relevant. But if the range is explicit and paying one person above that range will disadvantage the company (since they now have to increase the range and give more leverage to everyone else), they will be less flexible.

It should be good for the middle and low ends, but I expect pretty bad for the high-end of any given job type.

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