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Thomas Midgley Jr. invented leaded gasoline and chlorofluorocarbons

nytimes.com

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Re: Thomas Midgley Jr. invented leaded gasoline and chlorofluorocarbons

#121

Post by JPws_Prntr_Fngr »

Weneedlead wrote: post #116
JPws_Prntr_Fngr wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A gimmick account dedicated to lead advocacy. Interesting. Could you source any scientific papers (or even a schizo blog post!) we could read through? Because your Venezuelan eyesight anecdote is not very convincing.

[dead]

I don't follow. #2 is on nicotine exposure, and #3 concluded lead exposure is bad.

"Conclusion: Lead poison has a great effect on vision and eye health of the workers, its lead to decrease of vision result in development amblyopia, it also has influence on ocular media and causes severe allergic reaction Thus, all the workers in this field should wear the protection tools provided in the factory, and there is a critical need for examining their ocular health annually."

Re: Thomas Midgley Jr. invented leaded gasoline and chlorofluorocarbons

#122

Post by pfdietz »

dTal wrote: post #119
prennert wrote: post #45

This Cautionary Tales podcast episode talks about him [0]. Both were invented in the service of DuPont. CFC at least helped making refrigeration safer and helped getting it to the masses. Leaded gasoline on the other hand was always known as a bad idea. In both cases though, DuPont fought back hard to prevent bans of these solutions. They rather kill the planet than their profits. Suitably enough he killed himself wi…

I'm going to reiterate a point that needs to be repeated very loudly, as often as possible: Corporations are malignant paperclip maximizers. We are already in an "AI apocalypse". How many people did leaded fuel kill? Lead exposure makes people stupid and violent - how many wars did it indirectly contribute to, how far back has society been held? That's one corporation. One!! "Corporations bad" is a sort of tired left…

W. Dow Reider's "Doc Future" e-novels went in this direction, particularly the last not yet finished one. Recommended!

https://docfuture.tumblr.com/post/62787551366/stories

Re: Thomas Midgley Jr. invented leaded gasoline and chlorofluorocarbons

#123

Post by pfdietz »

zoltrix303 wrote: post #30
chuankl wrote: post #11

The absolute terrible thing about leaded gasoline is that they were already aware of several other additives (including ethanol, IIRC) that have the desired anti-knocking properties. But they went with tetraethyl lead anyway because it is cheaper and provided a few cents more profit per gallon. A cent was worth more back then than it does now, but still :-(

The most interesting to me is the correlation between the delinquency among children and teens, and the years of introduction of tetraethyl lead in gasoline for anti-knocking properties. I read somewhere that Thomas Midgley Jr could be considered, in modern history, to be the organism with highest impactful on earth with his invention of Chlorofurocarbons and their impact on the ozone layers. Source: https://en.m.wik…

Sort of like the anti Norman Borlaug.

Re: Thomas Midgley Jr. invented leaded gasoline and chlorofluorocarbons

#124

Post by circuit10 »

causi wrote: post #95
prennert wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did not mean to blame him for having polio. I just meant to say that his solution to his mobility problems came with significant tech debt that came to hang him later.

It was not a tech debt issue. He used it to commit suicide.

I thought it was an accident?

Re: Thomas Midgley Jr. invented leaded gasoline and chlorofluorocarbons

#125

Post by yesenadam »

kergonath wrote: post #70
paulpauper wrote: post #19

The Brilliant Inventor Who Made Two of History’s Biggest Mistakes Biggest ever? more than nuclear weapons? A bit of a stretch to say ever. I think this is disputable.

[flagged]

I'm not sure how to respond to that comment, which I find profoundly shocking and depressing. I've read some HN comments before which for some reason suggest a large-scale nuclear "war" wouldn't be so bad, but..this one seems even much worse, for some reason. I don't get it. I don't get how anyone could believe or write that.

Anything I could write seems so obvious. I can't think. I think I need a break from HN for a while. You don't seem to have been downvoted in 5 hours.

Re: Thomas Midgley Jr. invented leaded gasoline and chlorofluorocarbons

#126

Post by Weneedlead »

JPws_Prntr_Fngr wrote: post #121
Weneedlead wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[dead]

I don't follow. #2 is on nicotine exposure, and #3 concluded lead exposure is bad. "Conclusion: Lead poison has a great effect on vision and eye health of the workers, its lead to decrease of vision result in development amblyopia, it also has influence on ocular media and causes severe allergic reaction Thus, all the workers in this field should wear the protection tools provided in the factory, and there is a criti…

Tobacco smoke contains heavy metals, smoking rises lead levels. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/322790056_Blood_Lea...

11 out of the 76 short term exposed workers had myopia, while 10 out of 124 long term exposed workers had myopia, which is much less.

Re: Thomas Midgley Jr. invented leaded gasoline and chlorofluorocarbons

#127

Post by pfdietz »

kergonath wrote: post #70
paulpauper wrote: post #19

The Brilliant Inventor Who Made Two of History’s Biggest Mistakes Biggest ever? more than nuclear weapons? A bit of a stretch to say ever. I think this is disputable.

[flagged]

Arguably nuclear weapons have saved lives by suppressing conventional WW3, WW4, etc. At least, so far.

Re: Thomas Midgley Jr. invented leaded gasoline and chlorofluorocarbons

#128

Post by Weneedlead »

dTal wrote: post #119
prennert wrote: post #45

This Cautionary Tales podcast episode talks about him [0]. Both were invented in the service of DuPont. CFC at least helped making refrigeration safer and helped getting it to the masses. Leaded gasoline on the other hand was always known as a bad idea. In both cases though, DuPont fought back hard to prevent bans of these solutions. They rather kill the planet than their profits. Suitably enough he killed himself wi…

I'm going to reiterate a point that needs to be repeated very loudly, as often as possible: Corporations are malignant paperclip maximizers. We are already in an "AI apocalypse". How many people did leaded fuel kill? Lead exposure makes people stupid and violent - how many wars did it indirectly contribute to, how far back has society been held? That's one corporation. One!! "Corporations bad" is a sort of tired left…

Nobility used to have the highest lead levels, while violent tribes used to have the lowest. How do you explain that?

Re: Thomas Midgley Jr. invented leaded gasoline and chlorofluorocarbons

#130

Post by atombender »

If you're interested in this kind of narrative of brilliant scientists accidentally making things worse, I strongly recommend When We Cease to Understand the World [1] by Benjamin Labatut. A brilliant hybrid fiction/non-fiction book that goes into the story of Fritz Haber and other scientists whose inventions had an unexpected and negative impact on history.

[1] https://www.theguardian.com/books/2020/sep/10/when-we-cease-...

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