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Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

mullvad.net

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Re: Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

#41

Post by sva_ »

Zak wrote: post #24

There are an unusual number of comments from new accounts making disingenuous arguments on this post. I wonder who is behind the astroturfing. The answer to "what else should we do about bad people doing bad things?" is, of course how we usually catch people doing bad things: old-fashioned detective work. It involves taking reports of suspicious or illegal acts, interviewing witnesses and associates, requesting court…

Scrolling down... You weren't lying. I've recently been pondering more and more in how far governments use social media to manipulate our perception. The astroturfing has been pretty shamelessly obvious recently (in particular on sites like Reddit.)

On the other hand, since there seems to be so much going on, why aren't there any whistleblowers?

Re: Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

#42

Post by kneebonian »

lofaszvanitt wrote: post #29

The problem is there are no reports on what counter terrorism units achieved, how many potential attacks they thwarted because it would jepoardize their work, at least that's the mantra. So it's a you have to believe us that these measures is a must situation. The problem is, that the silicon we use in everyday hardware is a black box. Same applies to online services. We do not even know how Youtube's and other big s…

> The problem is there are no reports on what counter terrorism units achieved, how many potential attacks they thwarted because it would jepoardize their work,

I used to subscribe to this but then there was the governor's kidnapping plot in Minnesota that the FBI started blowing their own horn about and making such a big deal right up until it turned out that 6 of the 13 individuals involved were in fact members of the FBI. That kinda shook my trust in the whole "we can't talk about our success because it is top secret." Excuse

Re: Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

#43

Post by tpmx »

f_devd wrote: post #38
Zak wrote: post #24

There are an unusual number of comments from new accounts making disingenuous arguments on this post. I wonder who is behind the astroturfing. The answer to "what else should we do about bad people doing bad things?" is, of course how we usually catch people doing bad things: old-fashioned detective work. It involves taking reports of suspicious or illegal acts, interviewing witnesses and associates, requesting court…

> I wonder who is behind the astroturfing I noticed the same thing, but this really is a strange one since there isn't an obvious single party which would desire this legislation (from my limited view). External state-actors (e.g. China for proxy-policing), or non-democratic internal politicians/leaders (EU/EEA neo-facists?), is the only thing I can imagine.

More likely, TBH, in this case: Just one random person with a strong conviction and sub-par execution.

There is a meta-effect going on here: Your complaining about the now vastly downvoted comments is now filling the top of this topic.

Re: Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

#44

Post by manuelabeledo »

alphanullmeric wrote: post #36

Typical EU behaviour. Same ones constantly whining about how Swiss banks won’t adopt their financial surveillance policies. Governments love to call it transparency when trying to justifying violating other people’s privacy.

This is in no way comparable.

There is a case to be made against rich people trying to hide their wealth in Switzerland, while they live in an EU country. They are also the majority doing it, as no average Joe can.

Weakening cryptography with the excuse of going after a minuscule percentage of the population, is about effectively considering any citizen a potential criminal.

Re: Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

#45

Post by daveoc64 »

Zak wrote: post #24

There are an unusual number of comments from new accounts making disingenuous arguments on this post. I wonder who is behind the astroturfing. The answer to "what else should we do about bad people doing bad things?" is, of course how we usually catch people doing bad things: old-fashioned detective work. It involves taking reports of suspicious or illegal acts, interviewing witnesses and associates, requesting court…

Please remember the HN Guidelines:

> Please don't post insinuations about astroturfing, shilling, bots, brigading, foreign agents and the like. It degrades discussion and is usually mistaken. If you're worried about abuse, email hn@ycombinator.com and we'll look at the data.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

#46

Post by pilsetnieks »

f_devd wrote: post #38
Zak wrote: post #24

There are an unusual number of comments from new accounts making disingenuous arguments on this post. I wonder who is behind the astroturfing. The answer to "what else should we do about bad people doing bad things?" is, of course how we usually catch people doing bad things: old-fashioned detective work. It involves taking reports of suspicious or illegal acts, interviewing witnesses and associates, requesting court…

> I wonder who is behind the astroturfing I noticed the same thing, but this really is a strange one since there isn't an obvious single party which would desire this legislation (from my limited view). External state-actors (e.g. China for proxy-policing), or non-democratic internal politicians/leaders (EU/EEA neo-facists?), is the only thing I can imagine.

It's a tired tale by now but stirring shit (whatever shit wherever it happens) is literally part of the Russian playbook [1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics

Re: Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

#47

Post by halfjoking »

f_devd wrote: post #38
Zak wrote: post #24

There are an unusual number of comments from new accounts making disingenuous arguments on this post. I wonder who is behind the astroturfing. The answer to "what else should we do about bad people doing bad things?" is, of course how we usually catch people doing bad things: old-fashioned detective work. It involves taking reports of suspicious or illegal acts, interviewing witnesses and associates, requesting court…

> I wonder who is behind the astroturfing I noticed the same thing, but this really is a strange one since there isn't an obvious single party which would desire this legislation (from my limited view). External state-actors (e.g. China for proxy-policing), or non-democratic internal politicians/leaders (EU/EEA neo-facists?), is the only thing I can imagine.

Foreign Malign Influence Center? They seem so hostile to free speech, I’d be surprised if they weren’t astroturfing stuff like this.

https://mobile.twitter.com/NameRedacted247/status/1628847554...

Re: Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

#48

Post by zirgs »

dsign wrote: post #30

Ha! I probably should get a mullvad account just to support them (even if I use my own VPN). Something that is not discussed much in Sweden is surveillance via the bank system. Banks have access to customers' transaction information and use it for two purposes: the "useful" feature of telling their customer how many of their purchases were e.g. food vs entertainment or house rent, and--of course--for advertising thei…

Can't they already build profiles using info from their IRS?

Re: Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

#49

Post by theusgovt »

f_devd wrote: post #38
Zak wrote: post #24

There are an unusual number of comments from new accounts making disingenuous arguments on this post. I wonder who is behind the astroturfing. The answer to "what else should we do about bad people doing bad things?" is, of course how we usually catch people doing bad things: old-fashioned detective work. It involves taking reports of suspicious or illegal acts, interviewing witnesses and associates, requesting court…

> I wonder who is behind the astroturfing I noticed the same thing, but this really is a strange one since there isn't an obvious single party which would desire this legislation (from my limited view). External state-actors (e.g. China for proxy-policing), or non-democratic internal politicians/leaders (EU/EEA neo-facists?), is the only thing I can imagine.

[flagged]

Re: Mullvad's campaign against EU chat control

#50

Post by vuln »

pilsetnieks wrote: post #46
f_devd wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wonder who is behind the astroturfing I noticed the same thing, but this really is a strange one since there isn't an obvious single party which would desire this legislation (from my limited view). External state-actors (e.g. China for proxy-policing), or non-democratic internal politicians/leaders (EU/EEA neo-facists?), is the only thing I can imagine.

It's a tired tale by now but stirring shit (whatever shit wherever it happens) is literally part of the Russian playbook [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics

Really? Just the Russian playbook? No other country stirs shit up? No other country meddles in another country's affairs? No other country starts color revolutions to get someone they like to lead the country? No other country bombs another countries pipeline that serves "Allies"?
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